(03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Exactly. He just finds out he has this power that sets him above other cops. In the process, his personal life starts to fall apart. He's not willing to let that happen so he thinks a proposal is going to resolve things. That sounds desperate to me.
(03-03-2017, 06:54 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Exactly. He just finds out he has this power that sets him above other cops. In the process, his personal life starts to fall apart. He's not willing to let that happen so he thinks a proposal is going to resolve things. That sounds desperate to me.
You know I disagree i don't see his being a Grimm sets him above other police officers, it is just a different skill set. One that he uses to find the right person for the crime. He like a new tool in Portland's crime lab.
(03-03-2017, 07:14 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:54 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Exactly. He just finds out he has this power that sets him above other cops. In the process, his personal life starts to fall apart. He's not willing to let that happen so he thinks a proposal is going to resolve things. That sounds desperate to me.
You know I disagree i don't see his being a Grimm sets him above other police officers, it is just a different skill set. One that he uses to find the right person for the crime. He like a new tool in Portland's crime lab.
It really doesn't matter how we see Nick's grimmness now, does it? He loves being a grimm, but he would be blind, deaf, dumb and stupid if he didn't see what it was doing to his life with Juliette.
(03-03-2017, 06:29 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:20 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:15 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:09 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:04 AM)Grimmbiest11 Wrote: [ -> ]it was coming from s sincere place.
I believe this as well.
IMO Nick was in love but Juliette had her doubts, maybe she didn't want to be a cop's wife, maybe she had idea's of her life that she would have to give up to marry things like these, spoken or unspoken may have been in play. Juliette at that time may have been more complex character, that the writers never flush out.
Yes but here's the other side of the coin, js. Nick has just been given the very thing he apparently has needed all of his life, and that's to be a grimm. He told Hank he loved being a grimm. It's obvious he didn't want to give that up.
He also has a woman who's not happy with him the way he is, but he's not ready to give her up to be a grimm. So he does what he thinks is appealing to *her* and proposes.
So you're talking about the second almost proposal?
I don't think Nick was remotely aware of Juliette's true feelings about his Grimm life. She's worked hard to be let in from the outside only to find that it wasn't really all glitter and gold. She was steadfast in supporting him but for herself, it wasn't the life she envisioned. She thought being a cop's wife would be the most she'd have to deal with but now it wasn't. A powerless Nick was probably a godsend for her. She was thinking "FINALLY" they'll (read: she'll) get some peace but they'd long past the point of no return.
With the second proposal, he thinks they want the same things in life, they probably did but they'd never get them because he now valued being a Grimm above everything else.
Nick only proposed to Juliette once. Anything else doesn't count as a proposal.
(03-03-2017, 07:21 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:14 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:54 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Exactly. He just finds out he has this power that sets him above other cops. In the process, his personal life starts to fall apart. He's not willing to let that happen so he thinks a proposal is going to resolve things. That sounds desperate to me.
You know I disagree i don't see his being a Grimm sets him above other police officers, it is just a different skill set. One that he uses to find the right person for the crime. He like a new tool in Portland's crime lab.
It really doesn't matter how we see Nick's grimmness now, does it? He loves being a grimm, but he would be blind, deaf, dumb and stupid if he didn't see what it was doing to his life with Juliette.
In season 3 she jumped into the Grimm world with both feet so what was there for Nick to see?
(03-03-2017, 06:08 AM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ] (03-02-2017, 06:05 PM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]My real issue is with the brains who decided Juliette needed a complete overhaul.
Hi Iruk,
I agree. 
The "Brains" could have been NBC, G&K, or another source that expected the "overhaul" would be an improvement. The decision destroyed the character. Her brief time as Nick's nemesis provided some tense drama and in the Grimm world demanded her death. When the show killed her off it was time to move on without her. The huge error was to bring her back as FrankenEve, the Wooden Woman. 
N G
They never really killed her though, New Guy. Personally, I thought the whole Kelly betrayal thing was lame for a hexenbiest like Juliette. She would have never done that, and I don't know why making her a hexenbiest would have made her any different. She'd gotten revenge on Nick already and having her blow up over Adalind's pregnancy when she already knew that could happen once she talked to Nick......it's completely out of character for Juliette.
(03-03-2017, 07:23 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:21 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:14 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:54 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Exactly. He just finds out he has this power that sets him above other cops. In the process, his personal life starts to fall apart. He's not willing to let that happen so he thinks a proposal is going to resolve things. That sounds desperate to me.
You know I disagree i don't see his being a Grimm sets him above other police officers, it is just a different skill set. One that he uses to find the right person for the crime. He like a new tool in Portland's crime lab.
It really doesn't matter how we see Nick's grimmness now, does it? He loves being a grimm, but he would be blind, deaf, dumb and stupid if he didn't see what it was doing to his life with Juliette.
In season 3 she jumped into the Grimm world with both feet so what was there for Nick to see?
He proposed in season 1.
(03-03-2017, 07:25 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:08 AM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ] (03-02-2017, 06:05 PM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]My real issue is with the brains who decided Juliette needed a complete overhaul.
Hi Iruk,
I agree. The "Brains" could have been NBC, G&K, or another source that expected the "overhaul" would be an improvement. The decision destroyed the character. Her brief time as Nick's nemesis provided some tense drama and in the Grimm world demanded her death. When the show killed her off it was time to move on without her. The huge error was to bring her back as FrankenEve, the Wooden Woman.
N G
They never really killed her though, New Guy. Personally, I thought the whole Kelly betrayal thing was lame for a hexenbiest like Juliette. She would have never done that, and I don't know why making her a hexenbiest would have made her any different. She'd gotten revenge on Nick already and having her blow up over Adalind's pregnancy when she already knew that could happen once she talked to Nick......it's completely out of character for Juliette.
(03-03-2017, 07:23 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:21 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:14 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:54 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]Exactly. He just finds out he has this power that sets him above other cops. In the process, his personal life starts to fall apart. He's not willing to let that happen so he thinks a proposal is going to resolve things. That sounds desperate to me.
You know I disagree i don't see his being a Grimm sets him above other police officers, it is just a different skill set. One that he uses to find the right person for the crime. He like a new tool in Portland's crime lab.
It really doesn't matter how we see Nick's grimmness now, does it? He loves being a grimm, but he would be blind, deaf, dumb and stupid if he didn't see what it was doing to his life with Juliette.
In season 3 she jumped into the Grimm world with both feet so what was there for Nick to see?
He proposed in season 1.
Why only go the down on one knee he hinted very hard before they went to Monroe's and Rosalee's wedding and would have been down on one knee if she hadn't push it aside.
(03-03-2017, 07:31 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:25 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:08 AM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ] (03-02-2017, 06:05 PM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]My real issue is with the brains who decided Juliette needed a complete overhaul.
Hi Iruk,
I agree. The "Brains" could have been NBC, G&K, or another source that expected the "overhaul" would be an improvement. The decision destroyed the character. Her brief time as Nick's nemesis provided some tense drama and in the Grimm world demanded her death. When the show killed her off it was time to move on without her. The huge error was to bring her back as FrankenEve, the Wooden Woman.
N G
They never really killed her though, New Guy. Personally, I thought the whole Kelly betrayal thing was lame for a hexenbiest like Juliette. She would have never done that, and I don't know why making her a hexenbiest would have made her any different. She'd gotten revenge on Nick already and having her blow up over Adalind's pregnancy when she already knew that could happen once she talked to Nick......it's completely out of character for Juliette.
(03-03-2017, 07:23 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:21 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:14 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]You know I disagree i don't see his being a Grimm sets him above other police officers, it is just a different skill set. One that he uses to find the right person for the crime. He like a new tool in Portland's crime lab.
It really doesn't matter how we see Nick's grimmness now, does it? He loves being a grimm, but he would be blind, deaf, dumb and stupid if he didn't see what it was doing to his life with Juliette.
In season 3 she jumped into the Grimm world with both feet so what was there for Nick to see?
He proposed in season 1.
Why only go the down on one knee he hinted very hard before they went to Monroe's and Rosalee's wedding and would have been down on one knee if she hadn't push it aside.
First of all, a woman doesn't want a "hinted" proposal. Second, he just slept with Adalind. Is that really a time to *hint* at a proposal?
(03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:29 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:20 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:15 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:09 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ]I believe this as well.
IMO Nick was in love but Juliette had her doubts, maybe she didn't want to be a cop's wife, maybe she had idea's of her life that she would have to give up to marry things like these, spoken or unspoken may have been in play. Juliette at that time may have been more complex character, that the writers never flush out.
Yes but here's the other side of the coin, js. Nick has just been given the very thing he apparently has needed all of his life, and that's to be a grimm. He told Hank he loved being a grimm. It's obvious he didn't want to give that up.
He also has a woman who's not happy with him the way he is, but he's not ready to give her up to be a grimm. So he does what he thinks is appealing to *her* and proposes.
So you're talking about the second almost proposal?
I don't think Nick was remotely aware of Juliette's true feelings about his Grimm life. She's worked hard to be let in from the outside only to find that it wasn't really all glitter and gold. She was steadfast in supporting him but for herself, it wasn't the life she envisioned. She thought being a cop's wife would be the most she'd have to deal with but now it wasn't. A powerless Nick was probably a godsend for her. She was thinking "FINALLY" they'll (read: she'll) get some peace but they'd long past the point of no return.
With the second proposal, he thinks they want the same things in life, they probably did but they'd never get them because he now valued being a Grimm above everything else.
Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Yes, this is an apt description but while powerless he did "miss" it so as human, there was no more "calling"upon his life. He was aware of the unseen world and being a cop, in that position he felt inadequate to do what needed to be done as a protector rather than the hunter his species is known for.
(03-03-2017, 07:37 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:31 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:25 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:08 AM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ] (03-02-2017, 06:05 PM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]My real issue is with the brains who decided Juliette needed a complete overhaul.
Hi Iruk,
I agree. The "Brains" could have been NBC, G&K, or another source that expected the "overhaul" would be an improvement. The decision destroyed the character. Her brief time as Nick's nemesis provided some tense drama and in the Grimm world demanded her death. When the show killed her off it was time to move on without her. The huge error was to bring her back as FrankenEve, the Wooden Woman.
N G
They never really killed her though, New Guy. Personally, I thought the whole Kelly betrayal thing was lame for a hexenbiest like Juliette. She would have never done that, and I don't know why making her a hexenbiest would have made her any different. She'd gotten revenge on Nick already and having her blow up over Adalind's pregnancy when she already knew that could happen once she talked to Nick......it's completely out of character for Juliette.
(03-03-2017, 07:23 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 07:21 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]It really doesn't matter how we see Nick's grimmness now, does it? He loves being a grimm, but he would be blind, deaf, dumb and stupid if he didn't see what it was doing to his life with Juliette.
In season 3 she jumped into the Grimm world with both feet so what was there for Nick to see?
He proposed in season 1.
Why only go the down on one knee he hinted very hard before they went to Monroe's and Rosalee's wedding and would have been down on one knee if she hadn't push it aside.
First of all, a woman doesn't want a "hinted" proposal. Second, he just slept with Adalind. Is that really a time to *hint* at a proposal?
At the time she didn't know he had slept with Adalind if she had I would agree with your point but at this time she didn't know. Now are you saying if he had dropped to one knee she wouldn't a push it aside? Also I don't speak for all men and I know I don't speak for any women, so I'll take your word that a hinted proposal would be treated as non proposal. Now we are at our normal point of agreeing to disagree on this.
(03-03-2017, 07:45 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:36 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:29 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:20 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2017, 06:15 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]IMO Nick was in love but Juliette had her doubts, maybe she didn't want to be a cop's wife, maybe she had idea's of her life that she would have to give up to marry things like these, spoken or unspoken may have been in play. Juliette at that time may have been more complex character, that the writers never flush out.
Yes but here's the other side of the coin, js. Nick has just been given the very thing he apparently has needed all of his life, and that's to be a grimm. He told Hank he loved being a grimm. It's obvious he didn't want to give that up.
He also has a woman who's not happy with him the way he is, but he's not ready to give her up to be a grimm. So he does what he thinks is appealing to *her* and proposes.
So you're talking about the second almost proposal?
I don't think Nick was remotely aware of Juliette's true feelings about his Grimm life. She's worked hard to be let in from the outside only to find that it wasn't really all glitter and gold. She was steadfast in supporting him but for herself, it wasn't the life she envisioned. She thought being a cop's wife would be the most she'd have to deal with but now it wasn't. A powerless Nick was probably a godsend for her. She was thinking "FINALLY" they'll (read: she'll) get some peace but they'd long past the point of no return.
With the second proposal, he thinks they want the same things in life, they probably did but they'd never get them because he now valued being a Grimm above everything else.
Does he value being a Grimm above anything else or is a Grimm a calling that can't be in most cases turned down? Like can Superman ever stop being Superman?
Yes, this is an apt description but while powerless he did "miss" it so as human, there was no more "calling"upon his life. He was aware of the unseen world and being a cop, in that position he felt inadequate to do what needed to be done as a protector rather than the hunter his species is known for.
Good call on the inadequate feeling, you can't unknow something, and have Trubel do the Grimm work had it drawbacks we have put that into the mix also.