(09-17-2017, 08:46 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]Almost all modern drama defines characters by their objectives rather than their behavior. Cheat or break laws for personal gain, you're a villain; do the exact same things to help others, you're a hero. It's what brings in viewers and sells ad time and theater tickets, so I'd say it's a reflection of the values of modern society.
I'd say this is a good reason why Grimm wasn't renewed for a 7th season and why no spinoff is in the works. It appears the values of modern society are changing, at least with regard to Grimm that is.
I'm on the fence about whether the show lost viewers because it dropped the seasons-long royals arc in favor of the "war on terror" arc, or because that arc led to the show's most corrupt and amoral regular character winning election to public office.
Either way, the show lost its escapist fantasy quality and began to look too much like the real world.
(09-17-2017, 10:27 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]I'm on the fence about whether the show lost viewers because it dropped the seasons-long royals arc in favor of the "war on terror" arc, or because that arc led to the show's most corrupt and amoral regular character winning election to public office.
Either way, the show lost its escapist fantasy quality and began to look too much like the real world.
In terms of WotW, S1 is certainly my favorite because of the fairytale premise of the show. What followed after that was too generic by comparison and the longer it remained on air, the quality would drop as is typical of TV shows these days. I didn't stop watching simply because I loved the characters. In the later seasons my preference swung heavily away from the WotW stories towards character driven stories but that never fully materialised. I still miss the show.
(09-17-2017, 10:27 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]I'm on the fence about whether the show lost viewers because it dropped the seasons-long royals arc in favor of the "war on terror" arc, or because that arc led to the show's most corrupt and amoral regular character winning election to public office.
Either way, the show lost its escapist fantasy quality and began to look too much like the real world.
I think viewer values play a greater force in television series than we might think. I believe you were the one who said ratings plummeted when Juliette became a hexenbiest. At that time, and even today, viewers are frustrated that she got away with it because she changed to Eve, despite the fact that in the end, she had nothing.
(09-17-2017, 10:46 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]I think viewer values play a greater force in television series than we might think. I believe you were the one who said ratings plummeted when Juliette became a hexenbiest. At that time, and even today, viewers are frustrated that she got away with it because she changed to Eve, despite the fact that in the end, she had nothing.
No, I was the one who said ratings plummeted when the show dropped the royals and brought in BC.
I didn't like Juliette turning into a hexenbiest
and turning on Nick, because it seemed to me that the show had finally felt fully developed when Juliette and Wu were finally full-fledged scoobies. But if they'd been able to keep having Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio back as Kelly every season and Clair Coffee's pregnancy hadn't happened, they could have had Nick and Juliette get through her transformation together and add hexenbiest powers to the scooby team and I would have been fine with that.
(09-17-2017, 10:39 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (09-17-2017, 10:27 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]I'm on the fence about whether the show lost viewers because it dropped the seasons-long royals arc in favor of the "war on terror" arc, or because that arc led to the show's most corrupt and amoral regular character winning election to public office.
Either way, the show lost its escapist fantasy quality and began to look too much like the real world.
In terms of WotW, S1 is certainly my favorite because of the fairytale premise of the show. What followed after that was too generic by comparison and the longer it remained on air, the quality would drop as is typical of TV shows these days. I didn't stop watching simply because I loved the characters. In the later seasons my preference swung heavily away from the WotW stories towards character driven stories but that never fully materialised. I still miss the show.
The loss of the fairytale premise isn't talked about enough. I really liked that about season 1 myself.
Season 2 had elements of it like Juliette being awaken by a prince and that Rumplestiltskin episode that Wu played a big part in but other than that the fairytale elements nearly vanished. It simply became a monster hunting show that couldn't really be distinguished much from other shows of its ilk.
Season 4 was probably the last season that had some remnants of it. Adalind's prison adventures in Vienna, such as Hoffman and the Alice in Wonderland vibes we were getting were the last obvious examples I can think of at the moment.
I feel like G &K lost sight of how fairytales in this universe was supposed to be inspired by things that actually happened in their universe. I didn't even think about fairytales during the last two seasons.
(09-17-2017, 12:12 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: [ -> ] (09-17-2017, 10:39 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ] (09-17-2017, 10:27 AM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]I'm on the fence about whether the show lost viewers because it dropped the seasons-long royals arc in favor of the "war on terror" arc, or because that arc led to the show's most corrupt and amoral regular character winning election to public office.
Either way, the show lost its escapist fantasy quality and began to look too much like the real world.
In terms of WotW, S1 is certainly my favorite because of the fairytale premise of the show. What followed after that was too generic by comparison and the longer it remained on air, the quality would drop as is typical of TV shows these days. I didn't stop watching simply because I loved the characters. In the later seasons my preference swung heavily away from the WotW stories towards character driven stories but that never fully materialised. I still miss the show.
The loss of the fairytale premise isn't talked about enough. I really liked that about season 1 myself.
Season 2 had elements of it like Juliette being awaken by a prince and that Rumplestiltskin episode that Wu played a big part in but other than that the fairytale elements nearly vanished. It simply became a monster hunting show that couldn't really be distinguished much from other shows of its ilk.
Season 4 was probably the last season that had some remnants of it. Adalind's prison adventures in Vienna, such as Hoffman and the Alice in Wonderland vibes we were getting were the last obvious examples I can think of at the moment.
I feel like G &K lost sight of how fairytales in this universe was supposed to be inspired by things that actually happened in their universe. I didn't even think about fairytales during the last two seasons.
To me, Season 4 was the end. The viewership started to decline after it and was left with only the hard core and those wishing it would change. The casual viewer was lost due to what some of you are mentioning. The loss of the fairytale premise the previous seasons included.
If you look at the episode-by-episode viewer numbers, the decline starts when the wesenrein arc comes to the forefront (which was before Juliette became a hexenbiest).
Wesen nazis cost the show about 5% of its viewers. The numbers leveled off during the Nick and Juliette breakup and Jack the Ripper arcs. Then came the emergence of BC in the first half of S05, and by "Wesen Nacht" the show had lost another 24% of its viewers.
iI have to admit, I hated the BC storyline. Found it worse than the Royals storyline, which I didn't like much either. I wish they would have stuck with the original fairy tale premise of the show. Like some others here have said, season 1 was the best for me. I was drawn to the show because I found it original, I loved the setting, the wesen characters, even the music. It was that whimsical quality that slowly disappeared as the show progressed. The WoW rather than the characters personal drama was what attracted me to the show. Even in season 1, the characterisations weren't as good as the WoW/action scenes. I felt Juliette and Nick's storyline was a drag, wished Nick was given a chance to explore a relationship outside of Juliette (like with Ariel) instead of making him some love sick puppy always at her command. Despite the problems, still loved season 6, although felt it was way too short. Still think there was potential for further storylines to be explored, especially dealing with Kelly's unique heritage and his special abilities. Imo it ended much too soon.