Grimm Forum

Maybe it's just obvious me, but in this fantasy world of Wesen and non-Wesen existence. Humans developed a system of laws to deal with the criminal element in their mist. Wesen developed Grimms.

(09-23-2017, 10:03 PM)dicappatore Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe it's just obvious me, but in this fantasy world of Wesen and non-Wesen existence. Humans developed a system of laws to deal with the criminal element in their mist. Wesen developed Grimms.

More like the same force that created wesen, also created Grimms. Humans exist in their own bubble, where they see no wesen, hear no wesen, speak no wesen and the wesen community and Grimms complied with that for centuries because they exist in their own bubble separate from the humans that's why they can disregard human laws when it suited them. The problem is none of these groups exist in isolation, at some stage they need to come together, find common ground and work from there.

(09-23-2017, 05:50 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]I think they overestimated their own place in the wesen world and got sloppy. They had probably been coasting on their past history for a long time.

I can't see how they would be of any effect. They're remotely located to begin with, and it's obvious they don't have all of the resources to know when every single wesen might take the plunge and remain in permanent woge for all to see. They certainly didn't do anything about the wesen who was in the carnival.

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(09-23-2017, 10:10 PM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ]More like the same force that created wesen, also created Grimms. Humans exist in their own bubble, where they see no wesen, hear no wesen, speak no wesen and the wesen community and Grimms complied with that for centuries because they exist in their own bubble separate from the humans that's why they can disregard human laws when it suited them. The problem is none of these groups exist in isolation, at some stage they need to come together, find common ground and work from there.

I don't think wesen disregard human laws that often. I don't even think most of them want to be revealed as wesen, but instead want to be considered the same as humans. What I wonder is, if some wesen can really take the strain of appearing as total humans day after day. Or do those that can't turn to crime as a way of coping?

The show creators didn’t plan a Law & Order type series about Grimm & Wesen that presented the progression from crime to trial/conviction. Grimm was never more than a show about fairytale characters who interacted with a small number of humans in a modern-day setting. By S4 one human on Nick’s team was transformed into a Wesen by magic and by S5 another by infection, leaving only one human member by the show’s end. But that hardly mattered considering the three human members of Team Grimm were immediately assimilated into the fairytale Grimm-world ideology with little regard to the policing and ethical standards and familiar/established lifestyle they had lived by.

The only modern aspect of the show was the timeframe and Nick’s human-life / income-producing employment and the use of law enforcement procedures and technology favorable to his Grimm mission. The creative team rarely utilized it’s own creations to bridge the gap between fairytale Grimm and modern policing - such as forming a working relationship between Nick and the Wesen Council that would make both efforts more relevant and productive by developing a mutually benefiting avenue for dealing with Wesen crime under the radar of the human legal system. Nick determined whether offending Wesen were killed, arrested, or sent on their way - just as the Grimms before him had done.

Nick didn’t even have a reaction to learning the government, or at least the military, knew about Wesen, which flew in the face of his supposed modern day Grimm attitude. Nick had worked on his own for nearly four and half years, making those supposedly tough decisions of which Wesen would live and which would die, only to learn that the government knew and didn’t bother reaching out to Grimm and Wesen until it needed them to kill for its benefit. He didn’t even pursue finding out what HW did to the woman he supposedly loved and wanted to marry, much less it’s long-term plans for her.

Grimm was not a show about the legal system - procedural, ethical, or otherwise. Grimm was a fairytale about a mythical hero/warrior fighting mythical ferocious creatures with a little soap opera drama thrown into the mix. G & K disregarded previously established elements if they interfered with a particular story and invented new elements if needed to move a particular story along.

I never saw Nick, Hank, and Wu as representing meaningful and ethical law enforcement, but that part doesn’t bother me because I don’t think the show intended to make that statement one way or the other. The central character was probably a cop because the network wanted him to be instantly recognizable to the general viewership while learning about the mythical Grimm/Wesen world and its inhabitants. And the show’s creators and the Network accomplished that goal if viewers bought into their mythical Grimm/Wesen premise for forty-two minutes each week.

Trying to understand how the fairytale meshed or failed to mesh with real life is - as the Borg would say - futile. *grin*

(09-24-2017, 08:23 AM)Robyn Wrote: [ -> ]The show creators didn’t plan a Law & Order type series about Grimm & Wesen that presented the progression from crime to trial/conviction. Grimm was never more than a show about fairytale characters who interacted with a small number of humans in a modern-day setting. By S4 one human on Nick’s team was transformed into a Wesen by magic and by S5 another by infection, leaving only one human member by the show’s end. But that hardly mattered considering the three human members of Team Grimm were immediately assimilated into the fairytale Grimm-world ideology with little regard to the policing and ethical standards and familiar/established lifestyle they had lived by.

The only modern aspect of the show was the timeframe and Nick’s human-life / income-producing employment and the use of law enforcement procedures and technology favorable to his Grimm mission. The creative team rarely utilized it’s own creations to bridge the gap between fairytale Grimm and modern policing - such as forming a working relationship between Nick and the Wesen Council that would make both efforts more relevant and productive by developing a mutually benefiting avenue for dealing with Wesen crime under the radar of the human legal system. Nick determined whether offending Wesen were killed, arrested, or sent on their way - just as the Grimms before him had done.

Nick didn’t even have a reaction to learning the government, or at least the military, knew about Wesen, which flew in the face of his supposed modern day Grimm attitude. Nick had worked on his own for nearly four and half years, making those supposedly tough decisions of which Wesen would live and which would die, only to learn that the government knew and didn’t bother reaching out to Grimm and Wesen until it needed them to kill for its benefit. He didn’t even pursue finding out what HW did to the woman he supposedly loved and wanted to marry, much less it’s long-term plans for her.

Grimm was not a show about the legal system - procedural, ethical, or otherwise. Grimm was a fairytale about a mythical hero/warrior fighting mythical ferocious creatures with a little soap opera drama thrown into the mix. G & K disregarded previously established elements if they interfered with a particular story and invented new elements if needed to move a particular story along.

I never saw Nick, Hank, and Wu as representing meaningful and ethical law enforcement, but that part doesn’t bother me because I don’t think the show intended to make that statement one way or the other. The central character was probably a cop because the network wanted him to be instantly recognizable to the general viewership while learning about the mythical Grimm/Wesen world and its inhabitants. And the show’s creators and the Network accomplished that goal if viwers bought into their mythical Grimm/Wesen premise for forty-two minutes each week.

Trying to understand how the fairytale meshed or failed to mesh with real life is - as the Borg would say - futile. *grin*

Robyn, looks lke you hit another nail on it's head with this post. All that you said is why I look at the characters given to us on the screen and asses their actions and my conclusions on their persona we are presented with. I make sure my wished outcomes and re-writes are separated from the facts we get from the script.

Just imagine, if we expected the same "Rule of Law" was applied to the Savior/Police Chief to that other show still running, "Once Upon a Time".

I would love to see this standard applied to other TV series. "24" could have had seasons depicting the days Jack Bauer is indicted, convicted, sentenced, arrives at Leavenworth, etc., leading up to the final season when he's released.

(09-24-2017, 07:27 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-23-2017, 05:50 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: [ -> ]I think they overestimated their own place in the wesen world and got sloppy. They had probably been coasting on their past history for a long time.

I can't see how they would be of any effect. They're remotely located to begin with, and it's obvious they don't have all of the resources to know when every single wesen might take the plunge and remain in permanent woge for all to see. They certainly didn't do anything about the wesen who was in the carnival.

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(09-23-2017, 10:10 PM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ]More like the same force that created wesen, also created Grimms. Humans exist in their own bubble, where they see no wesen, hear no wesen, speak no wesen and the wesen community and Grimms complied with that for centuries because they exist in their own bubble separate from the humans that's why they can disregard human laws when it suited them. The problem is none of these groups exist in isolation, at some stage they need to come together, find common ground and work from there.

I don't think wesen disregard human laws that often. I don't even think most of them want to be revealed as wesen, but instead want to be considered the same as humans. What I wonder is, if some wesen can really take the strain of appearing as total humans day after day. Or do those that can't turn to crime as a way of coping?

The only thing I saw the Council concerned about was woging in public. Rob a bank, be a whore monger, extort money from another wessen and kill them, no problem. Do it woged, off with with their heads. You don't need to kill a lot of bad apples to keep the mass of people in line.

I think most wesen try out live under the radar not just because of the fear that the council might come after them and kill them, it's also because they are aware of their own history. They know what would happen if humans found out what they really were i.e executions, incarceration, turned into pariahs and cast out from human society.

(09-24-2017, 04:11 PM)wesen Wrote: [ -> ]I think most wesen try out live under the radar not just because of the fear that the council might come after them and kill them, it's also because they are aware of their own history. They know what would happen if humans found out what they really were i.e executions, incarceration, turned into pariahs and cast out from human society.

It might not only be the humans who are the problem, but the wesen themselves. Monroe himself stated how he used to go hunting with his grandfather. Nick cut in before Monroe could state that he was hunting for humans. Just because Monroe has reformed into a vegetarian doesn't mean other Blutbads have. Imagine them all of the sudden being in the spotlight over human "disappearances".

Wesen are just like ordinary humans. Those who have managed to make a comfortable life for themselves in modern society like things just fine the way they are and fear and resist change that introduces uncertainty into their lives. Those who haven't fared as well divide into three groups: those who work a lot harder trying to succeed; those who turn to crime looking for shortcuts; and those who wax nostalgic for some imagined "good old days" when everything was perfect, look for others to blame for their failures and tell themselves that if only "those people" could be put down all of their problems would end.