(12-28-2016, 05:30 AM)New Guy Wrote:(12-27-2016, 04:56 PM)irukandji Wrote:Hi Iruk,(12-26-2016, 06:22 PM)New Guy Wrote: Hi Iruk,
It is clear that you do not consider Nick to be Prince Charming, nor do I. However IMO, (non-clinical) Nick is not a "sociopath."
The Google definition of sociopath is:
Quote:a person with a personality disorder manifesting itself in extreme antisocial attitudes and behavior and a lack of conscience.There are many articles about the disorder, including this:
http://www.medicaldaily.com/4-signs-soci...der-406895
Again, IMO Nick does not have any of these four:
His ego is not in excess. He does have self esteem and confidence to face extreme situations. I have worked for and around some extreme egomaniacs and Nick is nothing like them.
You have made it clear he is not "charming." He does not manipulate others, but presents them with choices that may get them to side with him. If he was a manipulator, Hank and Wu would have asked to be removed from his cases, if they managed to stay alive. They both seem to like working with Nick.
IMO, Nick cares deeply about others. Note how other Grimms kill upon seeing a woge. Not Nick. It was his love for Juliette that made him release the strangle hold and to give up fighting. When Renard showed the surveillance video, he wanted to turn himself in and face the consequences. Compare that to FrankenEve's BS that it was Juliette, not her, who committed all the violent acts of hatred. IMO the Scoobies consider Nick a close friend and worthy of their trust.
If Nick had significant "Brushes" with the law then he would have lost his PPD badge and be doing who knows what. In one case, he asked Renard if he was being suspended, but he was not. I have read your many dissertations about how he operates outside police procedural rules, but IMO he handles Wesen crime within the Grimm procedural rules with (usually) approval by his Captain, Renard.
If there is a sociopath on the show it is Royal Prince Captain Mayor Elect Sean Renard. He is egotistical, manipulative and heartless.
N G
Hello New Guy-
Actually there are other signs of sociopaths as well. I assume that you, like me, are keeping in mind that sociopaths do not have to exhibit all of the attributes in order to be sociopaths. Here are some additional signs:
Lying and manipulative behavior-I would say that applies to Nick.
Lack of empathy. This goes along with the don't care about others in your article, so it's not an additional sign. However, it does apply to Nick. For instance, if you believe Adalind when she told Nick she loved him (on several occasions, actually), that's a statement generally put out to elicit a response. Nick has actually chosen to ignore it, rather than acknowledging he loves her in return or being honest with her and telling her he doesn't love her.
Showing lack of remorse or shame-I would say that applies to Nick.
Staying eerily calm in scary or dangerous situations-Nick never really ever expresses fear, even in disturbing or dangerous situations.
Behaving irresponsibly or with extreme impulsivity-Definitely a Nick trademark here.
Living by the “pleasure principle-If it feels good, do it and avoid the consequences. Yes, this is Nick once again.
Showing disregard for societal norms-Nick, BIG TIME!
Having “intense” eyes. This was an unusual one, but the article I read interpreted this as maintaining uninterrupted eye contact. Failure to look away politely is perceived as aggressiveness or seductive. However, what I find interesting were the comments people made about the change in Grimm banners. In one, Nick's eyes were yellow. In another, blue. He does have intense eyes.
I'd say Nick is a sociopath, New Guy. There are probably other signs the two of us have missed.
I continue to disagree and see no substantive evidence to your claim Nick is a sociopath. However, you are entitled to your own opinion.
IMO, the show's real sociopath is Renard. He is the egomaniac, manipulative, self-centered creep that the writers indicate will soon be the major evil one on the show. You should enjoy it since his goal will be to kill Nick.
N G
Hello New Guy-
I know you believe Renard is the sociopath here and I really don't disagree with you. He's used people for his own gains. If you notice, Renard and Nick do not pal around together. They run in their own circles, each doing their own thing independent of the other.
But there is a major difference between Renard and Nick. Nick has gathered a small force of people about him. These people are so enamored of him that they will do anything for him, lie, murder, kidnap, even mutilation. All in the name of Nick's noble cause of Grimmdom, which as of yet no one has defined from beginning to end. In his own way, Nick is no different than Jim Jones. So, in my opinion, as you so aptly stated, Nick is a true sociopath.
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