(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 11:28 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: There was a specific threat on Kelly's head. This all started because someone tried to murder her and her husband. In his case, they succeeded. She felt that in going back, the target ends up on his back as well. And if Marie doesn't take gaurdianship, Nick would have wound up in foster care.
The specific threat on Kelly's head was of her own doing. She caused the problems, no one else did. That tells me that instead of tending to her husband and son, she saw the grimm life as more important. She owed it to her son to be a mother to him, not to dump him off on her own sister because it's inconvenient for her. That's not fair to him. You keep talking about this big threat to her and potential threat to him. The threat doesn't diminish because she dumped him on her sister. It just becomes a different type of threat. Both of them were on the run for it. I can't see why Kelly didn't face responsibilities, take her son, and raise him.
If a person in some branch of the military or law enforcement draws the wrath of a criminal enterprise, are they to blame for whatever danger their family may face? If you say that they are, then should anyone with a family never take on such a profession? Kelly's goal was to keep something very dangerous out of the hands of evil. If she doesn't bear this burden, who will? An attempt was made on Kelly's life, because she was perceived as a threat to dangerous individuals. In faking her demise, it relieved the threat to Nick. He was of no significance to Kelly's enemies, unless she remained by his side. Marie was clearly at something of a remove from this particular fight, so any threats to her would have been less specific. She could put whatever Grimm life she was living, on hold until Nick was grown. Now, I don't entirely believe Kelly made the right choice. I feel that Nick and Adalind's approach to raising their children is healthier. Learning about the realities they face and training to deal with them, will make Kelly and Diana better prepared. But saying that Nick's mom was in some way indifferent to him, is way off base. She loved him and regretted her choice. Kelly said as much to him in the trailer, when she told Nick not to make the mistake she did. Telling him to keep the people he loves, close to him.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 11:28 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: Trubel is a prime example of how badly that can go.
Trubel isn't a prime example of anything because we know nothing about her.
We know plenty about her troubles in foster care. The assault that led Trubel to see her first Woge. The murder of her foster parents. She was with people who couldn't protect her, and had no way of walking her through what was happening. She's quite damaged when Nick first encounters her. If that's not a cautionary tale, I don't know what is.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 11:28 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: It's likely that Marie kept her Grimm work to a minimum during those six or so years she was watching over him. Once he was out of the house, she returned to her wandering lifestyle. The reason she did this, as well as the reason she and Kelly made the decision to keep the truth hidden, was because of the possibility Nick might not be a Grimm. If he could have a normal life, removed from all of this darkness, they felt it would be a lesser burden to think of his mother as dead, then to weigh him down with something that would irrevocably alter his world.
The fear that Nick might not be a grimm is not a good reason to hide the truth from him. In my opinion, this is just another example of how these two women botched things up, big time.
What I wonder is why, when things calmed down, why Kelly didn't have the courage to take Nick and raise him.
Things didn't calm down. This business with the coins was still going on when Nick is a grown man. Kelly's apparent death is what kept it away from her family. But I agree that keeping his potential future a secret, wasn't the right choice. I understand Kelly and Marie's motivation, but I feel Nick and Adalind's approach is healthier. Had Nick not been trained as a cop, this would have been much more difficult for him.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 06:49 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: All of this coin drama fell in Nick's lap. It had become a threat to him. Kelly came back because this was a burden she didn't want for him. Had she not cared, then why not just let Nick watch over them. She knew that this problem would dog him, just as it affected their family in the past. So taking up that burden, was the best thing she could do for him.
This burden she didn't want a 30 year old man to face, but when he was a child and faced many burdens, the egg donor was no where to be found. That's a real strange contradiction in a so called mother.
The burden he faced as a child, was grief. It's a little different than having people try and murder you. The coins were always the burden Kelly bore. The thing that divided her family. She didn't want another generation to carry that weight. Nick had enough on his plate, coming to terms with being a Grimm. As a mother, the least she could do was to take that albatross from around his neck.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 06:49 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: Juliette wouldn't have become a Hexenbeist without Diana's existence.
That's not a positive thing on which to blame Diana
It doesn't need to be positive or negative to be an effect of her existence. And it's also not blame. It wasn't her fault she got kidnapped.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 06:49 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: Adalind wouldn't have begun her redemptive arc without that girl.
I disagree. Adalind started on a redemptive course long before she ever got Diana back.
True. But I wasn't talking about getting her back. I was talking about conception. Adalind's slow march to redemption began with her pregnancy.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 06:49 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: Zerstorer would have never been defeated if she hadn't opened the portal.
Zerstorer never would have gotten through if she hadn't opened the portal in the first place.
She's just a little girl, and the decision she makes comes from a good hearted place. Though it's true that this allows Zerstorer to follow them, without this he can not be defeated. They had to pass through a crucible, in order to win the day. Her action sets the stage.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 06:49 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: She doesn't have to be actively making choices that alter things. Diana does that simply by being. The same is true of Kelly.
You've just reduced both of them to props by this statement. What's the point of having these special children if they do...........nothing?
If you're asking me what's the point of children, that seems like a longer, (though more rudimentary), discussion about biological imperative. Pertaining to Diana and Kelly, it's not too dissimilar. Love. Family. Legacy. We see their ultimate destiny as capable and well adjusted adults. As a girl, Diana is well defined as her own, odd little person. She certainly has a profound effect on events. I mean, she did kill last season's uber-villain for starters. And as far as Kelly goes...he's a baby! Unless they turned him into some CG, talking infant monstrosity, I'm not sure what you expect him to do, other than be cute. In relation to that, I suppose he is something of a prop in his early years. But I, for one, wasn't expecting him to recite any monologues about strained peas and diaper rash.
(05-06-2017, 12:07 PM)irukandji Wrote:(05-06-2017, 06:49 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: Kelly merely being born, he has redefined Adalind and Nick's lives. And by virtue of this, everyone else's.
Let me ask this. You say Kelly was needed to redefine Nick and Adalind's lives. Are they, in your opinion, cardboard characters who are incapable of developing on their own?
I didn't say Kelly was "needed" to redefine Nick and Adalind's lives. He simply did. That tends to be the case when baby's enter the picture. Before Kelly, their lives were one way. After his birth, they were another. Redefined. Had they not brought the wee Grimm into the world, their course would have been vastly different. Characters are always being redefined by circumstance. A baby is about as big as circumstances get. This is experiential development. Nothing happens, "on it's own", because most people don't live in a vacuum.