Grimm Forum

(06-18-2017, 11:12 AM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-18-2017, 07:54 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2017, 02:57 PM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ]promiscuous
adjective
1. characterized by or involving indiscriminate mingling or association, especially having sexual relations with a number of partners on a casual basis.
2. consisting of parts, elements, or individuals of different kinds brought together without order.
3. indiscriminate; without discrimination.
4. casual; irregular; haphazard.
IMO, Juliette meets definition 2 of "whore" by her her fornication with Renard and Kenneth. She meets definition 1 of "promiscuous" because she fornicated both Renard and Kenneth.

New Guy, you are interpreting this definition incorrectly. Juliette does not meet the definition of a whore as noted in 2.

Her hookups with Renard and Kenneth were not brought together without order. There was order to them.

She went to Renard initially for help, then went back to him for a place to stay. She slept with him.

Later, she was approached by Kenneth to help secure Diana. Once Diana was secured, she was going with the royals. She slept with Kenneth. No one knows for sure whether their association would be more than a permanent one. What we do know is that there was an order to Juliette sleeping with Kenneth.

She is not a whore by virtue of the very definition you quoted.

As a matter of fact, neither Renard or Kenneth are whores either. Renard worked with Adalind and ended up in a relationship with her. Renard also worked with Rachel and ended up in a relationship with her.

Kenneth approached Juliette and as a result of their working together, they slept together.

All were logical progressions of what could turn out to be or just as easily turn out not to be relationships. That does not make the people who get into these relationships whores.

Hi Iruk,
In post #4 of this thread, I provided two definitions "Whore" and "Promiscuous."
Why are you examining the promiscuous definition to support your position about her being a whore? Are you confused?

She is a whore because she is a person who is sexually promiscuous.
To repeat my post, she meets definition 1 of "promiscuous" because she fornicated both Renard and Kenneth. Depending on your time frame, you could also count Nick as another of her partners in fornication. Spurning Nick's marriage proposal makes their fornication also casual. Three casual fornication partners makes her categorically a Whore.

These characters all had sex outside of marriage, therefore they are all fornicators.

I'm not a fan of these kinds of threads that are too liberal in shaming and degrading women when men aren't given the same treatment. It's reeks of sexism, intended or not.

This thread absolutely has sexist undertones to it which is why I've stayed out of it until now.

I definitely won't go over how Juliette turning down Nick's proposal doesn't reflect negatively on her again. There was nothing wrong with that and it doesn't make her a whore or their relationship casual. They lived in the same house for years, didn't step out on each other, and presumably both paid the bills. That's a committed relationship. It's not marriage or nothing. A ring or no ring means nothing because that wouldn't have saved their relationship. It would've ended just the same once Juliette became a Hexenbiest.

(06-18-2017, 08:51 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]Nick's abject failure was telling Juliette,

"I'm not going to let it destroy what we have".

What in essence he's telling Juliette is that she's not good enough for him any longer and will never be until she gets rid of the hexenbiest. I made a mistake, thinking that if he told her he loved her at the police station and also said he wasn't taking Adalind's place, that might be enough to salvage their relationship.

Now I see why she laughed at him when he said he loved her. Who could believe a man who not so long before that stated that Juliette as a hexenbiest would destroy what they have?

As usual you change the script to suit your conclusions. Your conclusion is based on switching the two occurrences around

As we can see the sequences of what happened He told her he loved her more than the one time you are referring to and before the police station

3rd After the rabbit foot investigation he comes home and talks about Henrietta and says
He isn’t giving up. Wont let it destroy what they have. He has to learn to understand her
She asks him to kiss her in Hex form then walks out.

4th, S4, E15 Nick is at home waiting for her. He leaves a message to call back to talk to her.talk to her.

5th. Outside the trailer with Hank in the trailer. He leaves her a voice mail asking for a call back

S4, E16
6th Nick is having coffee with Hank and calls her again. Call goes to voice mail. He tells Hank she is a Hex now.

7th Nick is at home sending Trubel an email. Juliet walks in with her own keys she still has. So much for “A BREAK UP”. She is there to pick up her stuff. He tells her it’s is fault He wants to talk about this. He hasn’t given up yet and he still loves her. She laughs at his face before he gets the call from Hank and ridicules him for doing his job as a detective.

S4, E17, The episode opens with Nick at home eating alone. The Juliette whore is spreading her legs for Sean to thank him for the day or two stay in his house.as she is getting asked to leave.

8th At the spice shop, she shows up looking for help. Tells the gang she is a Hex. Nicks tells her it’s his fault. She walks out on him. The episode ends with Nick staring at a photo or the two of them.

S4, E18
9th Nick visits Juliette in jail. He asks her why she is doing this. No need to prove to him it’s his fault. She is not giving them a chance to figure it out. She doesn’t scare him. and he won’t let her go. And he can never hurt her

She in turn asks if he could just crawl in bed with her as she voge and asks Nick if he could just close his eyes. What a nice girlfriend. Still asking if he would sleep with her with that look she never displayed for Sean or Ken.

10th, At the end of e18. Nick visits her again in jail but she is sleeping and he just is looking at here thinking about the earlier conversation.

The next 3 scenes show’s Juliette’s is out of the house but in her mind she is still with Nick. Not on any breakup.

A4, E19,
11th Rosalee visits Juliette in jail Now this is one confused bitch sitting in jail.

Scene: Rosalee goes to visit Juliette in jail.
________________________________________
Juliette: [She and Rosalee both pick up the phones] Rosalee, it's so nice of you to pop by.
Rosalee: Juliette, I just-I wanted you to know how sorry I am for everything that's going on. I've-I feel partially responsible.
Juliette: You are, but I don't blame you. In fact, I think I should thank you.
Rosalee: No, look. Juliette, this isn't you.
Juliette: It wasn't me. But it sure is now. What happened? Did Nick come over and do a big boo hoo with you?
Rosalee: He loves you.
Juliette: That's really nice, Rosalee, but can the love stuff. I mean, life is so much more interesting now. I mean, would you give up being a Fuchsbau if you could?
Rosalee: I-I would if it was the only way I could be with Monroe.
Juliette: And would he do the same for you?
Rosalee: I believe he would.
Juliette: Well, Nick wouldn't give it up for me. He had the chance.
Rosalee: You can't blame Nick for that. We needed him back because of the threats against us. And you agreed.
Juliette: No, no, no. I'm not complaining. Like, everything just worked out for the best. You got your husband back, Nick is a Grimm again, and I am on top of the world.
Rosalee: No. No. You're-you're angry and you're bitter and I don't blame you. I mean, nobody-nobody does. We're your friends, though. Juliette, I'm your friend, and I know you, and I know you're still in love with Nick.
Juliette: Thanks for stopping by. [She sets the phone down and walks away]
Rosalee: Juliette!
12th The precinct scene. Talk about a woman on a break up! If she is on a break why ask who he is choosing?

[Outside of the precinct, Juliette pulls up]
Adalind: I'm gonna have our baby, Nick. There's only one person who can stop me.
Nick: [He pulls his hand back] I'll take you to Rosalee, but I don't know if she'll help.
Renard: I honestly don't think this can get any more complicated.
Adalind: [She and Nick leave Renard's office] This was a big shock to me too. It never even occurred to me that something like this could—
Nick: It happened.
[They run into Juliette in the hallway]
Nick: Juliette...
Juliette: So it's true. You really are gonna have a baby. Well, congratulations. [She starts walking forward] I should've finished you off when I had the chance.
Adalind: Keep her away from me, Nick.
Juliette: Well, don't you two make a cute couple.
Nick: Juliette, you know how this happened.
Juliette: I sure do. Adalind told me it was a real whopper.
[Wu and Hank come into the hallway]
Adalind: Juliette, listen to me. I came here because I have a way of helping you.
Juliette: I've had enough of your help.
Nick: Nothing's gonna happen here. I'm sorry, Juliette, but you have to leave.
Juliette: Really, Nick? That's what I have to do? Let me tell you what I'm going to do. I'm going to rip this little bitch's throat out.
Nick: You are in a police station—
Juliette: I am in hell, Nick. And it is time she went there with me.
Nick: No matter what you think about her, the child is innocent.
[Renard, Franco, and other officers watch in the hallway]
Juliette: You mean your child?
Nick: Juliette—
Juliette: No child of hers is innocent.
Nick: [He grabs Juliette's arm] Don't.
Juliette: You're choosing her over me.
Nick: That is not what I'm doing.
Juliette: Then get out of my way.
Wu: Hey. Everything okay here, Nick?
Nick: Yeah. We're just working something out.
Adalind: We're not working anything out. She needs to leave.
Juliette: She's right. I do need to leave. We'll catch up later. [She leaves]


I guess you saw Episode 19, 18, 17, 16, 15, 14, while the rest of us saw 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, and 19, this is the police station episode. She laughed at his face way back on E16.

You then go and nit-pick on 2 of my post and accuse me leaving out some of the details. Even in this post you say He only told her of his love for her was in the station when the rest of us heard him say that to her before the police station and in multiple occasions.

So I twist my post to support my opinions. You leave out whole conversations and change the sequences of event.

So which is it? Are you doing it on purpose? Are you just forgetful.

I think because the two - Juliette and Nick- end.

(06-18-2017, 01:52 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: [ -> ]This thread absolutely has sexist undertones to it which is why I've stayed out of it until now.

I definitely won't go over how Juliette turning down Nick's proposal doesn't reflect negatively on her again. There was nothing wrong with that and it doesn't make her a whore or their relationship casual. They lived in the same house for years, didn't step out on each other, and presumably both paid the bills. That's a committed relationship. It's not marriage or nothing. A ring or no ring means nothing because that wouldn't have saved their relationship. It would've ended just the same once Juliette became a Hexenbiest.

Hello Hell,
It is easy to read the data about marriage and society. In education, finance, and crime, marriage matters. Children are particularly affected by marital status of parents:
http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/m...ildren.cfm
IMO, Juliette was not able to take marital vows. She did not love him. She made no commitment to him. Nick bought a ring and proposed. She spurned him.
N G

(06-18-2017, 03:03 PM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ]Hello Hell,
It is easy to read the data about marriage and society. In education, finance, and crime, marriage matters. Children are particularly affected by marital status of parents:
http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/m...ildren.cfm
IMO, Juliette was not able to take marital vows. She did not love him. She made no commitment to him. Nick bought a ring and proposed. She spurned him.
N G

Here is a non-scientific observation.

When I was in grade school. Way back in the 60’s. Having a classmate with divorced parents was rare. Maybe one or two in a class.

When my kids were in grade school back in the late 90’s & early 2K, classmate of theirs with their non-divorced parents was uncommon. More of their classmates had divorced parents than non-divorced. Maybe 50 to 60%. As a society, whatever we are doing is not working well..

(06-18-2017, 11:16 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]Not confused in the least New Guy. What I see here is the general male perception of what constitutes a whore. In my opinion, it's not accurate in my view as a female and is not consistent with the definitions provided.

The definitions are not mine, nor are they a "male perception."

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/whore

Quote:a person who is sexually promiscuous.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/promiscuous

Quote:having sexual relations with a number of partners on a casual basis.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fornication

Quote:consensual sexual intercourse between two persons not married to each other

Fact: Juliette had consensual sexual intercourse but was not married
Fact: Juliette had sexual relations with a number of partners on a casual basis.
Fact: Juliette was a person who was sexually promiscuous.

Iruk, these are irrefutable facts and based on the definitions Juliette was a whore. Adalind also meets all three definitions.

If you wish to prove me incorrect, you will need to prove that she did not fornicate Renard, Kenneth and Nick. If Nick was her only sexual partner, she would not meet the definition. Lacking that, your opinion seems indefensible and Juliette is a whore.

N G

Juliette never received money for having sex and that was not why she did it with Sean and Ken.
As Juliette mentions had another boyfriend before Nick- his status is dead.wikia- and also met Nick's girlfriend.

(06-18-2017, 03:16 PM)dicappatore Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-18-2017, 03:03 PM)New Guy Wrote: [ -> ]Hello Hell,
It is easy to read the data about marriage and society. In education, finance, and crime, marriage matters. Children are particularly affected by marital status of parents:
http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/m...ildren.cfm
IMO, Juliette was not able to take marital vows. She did not love him. She made no commitment to him. Nick bought a ring and proposed. She spurned him.
N G

Here is a non-scientific observation.

When I was in grade school. Way back in the 60’s. Having a classmate with divorced parents was rare. Maybe one or two in a class.

When my kids were in grade school back in the late 90’s & early 2K, classmate of theirs with their non-divorced parents was uncommon. More of their classmates had divorced parents than non-divorced. Maybe 50 to 60%. As a society, whatever we are doing is not working well..

Agree. It is sad.

(06-18-2017, 04:52 PM)brandon Wrote: [ -> ]Juliette never received money for having sex and that was not why she did it with Sean and Ken.
As Juliette mentions had another boyfriend before Nick- his status is dead.wikia- and also met Nick's girlfriend.

brandon can you link this wikia?