Grimm Forum

Nick hadn't chosen Adalind over Juliette, he chose to protect an unborn child.

The suppressant was a temp solution yes but when you consider how extreme and quickly Juliette's change happened (I'm referring to her attitude and not her hexenbiest) the suppressant could have afforded her the time she needed for her and Nick to prepare for the inevitable.

When Juliette transformed, it was immediate, unexpected and traumatic to her. Her emotions were all over the place and at the mercy of powers beyond her ability to control. With the suppressant wearing off, those powers would have trickled back instead of being hit all at once as we saw. Mentally she'd be prepared and likely get counciling from a hexenbiest, like Sean's mother and not Adalind or get the HW treatment without "killing" the Juliette persona and still help the scoobies or HW. She would have been herself and not some vengeful hateful woman or the robotic emotionless version. Nick would have been supportive of her and accept the love of his life biest and all because there would be trust between them that they weren't going to kill each other in their sleep. She wouldn't have turned on her friends because she would have had some measure of control. It's not a certainty but a chance I would have taken instead of what we got.

You don't see the benefit of the suppressant while I see/saw it as a means to salvage Juliette's humanity and her relationships with her friends as well as Nick. In her right mind Juliette would feel terrible for what she did. For all we know, the magic stick emotionally reawakened Juliette and we'll see her guilt over her actions (not the acceptance of her biestiness). In a roundabout way the stick would have suppressed the more vile tendencies of her synthetic yet powerful hexenbiest and enable her to come to terms with what she is without losing who she is.

I don't like Juliette, I never have but I truly believe she deserved better than what they wrote after she got her powers. I saw so much potential in her transformation but they opted for cheap drama and gave us S5, Nick and Adalind (I like them together but I'm not blind to how badly they have been written as a couple or as individuals) among other not so great things. Instead of making Nick and Juliette so much stronger because of her transformation they destroyed a character that had already been through so much because of being in Nick's world. I have zero interest in Eve, who wanted to convince people she wasn't Juliette but failed imo because of how she responded to Nick and Adalind (like I said cheap drama).

What little interest I almost had in her storyline when Juliette transformed died twice, in S4 after burning the trailer and Kelly's death and this past season after she came back from the dead as Eve. Which is sadly ironic because the most positive I have ever felt for her character was that brief period between her getting her powers and her going mental on her friends. Its too bad I can't get back to that and instead am stuck with one of the worst storylines this show has ever come up with.

we saw in Adalind there is no easing into being a hexenbiest. you do not learn to be a hexenbiest. It is what you are instantly. From the moment Juliette changed she was full blown hexenbiest. You saw how with Juliette the driver upset her she blow up the car. With Adalind she breaks all of Tony's fingers instead of throwing him out. Remember with in the first day Juliette had the dream of getting mad at Rosale and ripping her throat out. That was what Adalind was saying. Hexenbiest don't get mad they get even on instinct. They function on impulse. What Eve has learned is to control the impulse. Adalind has not. Being suppressed Juliette could not learn impulse control or how to control her powers.
As long as Nick saw Juliette as Juliette he would have never been able to work with her. Nick would have upset her she would have hurt him. That is what both Juliette and Adalind told him. Nick sees them as others see them. Why would they hurt someone they care about. Problem, that is not how hexenbiest work. Like Henrietta said hexenbiest have access to a very primal force. She is like Adalind something that is not human and does not function like a human. That was what Sean was trying to tell Nick. Because Juliette and Adalind look and talk like a female. He can not see they are wild animals with all the dangers of a wild animal.

The powers themselves aren't the issue, it's her response to the powers, how she deals with them returning. And we were told that Adalind's powers weren't at full strength when Eve confronted her at the loft.

Mentally, Juliette was at a worse place than Adalind when they got their powers (back). The conditions may seem the same but they are different, case in point, the truth is out and nick and Adalind are sort of kind of together despite the mayoral plot from the end of S5 (Nick wants to get her back along with his son in S6). That temporary reprieve would have gone a long way in stabilising Juliette's emotions so the hexenbiest wouldn't take absolute control of her. Juliette went from 1-100 in 0.3 secs flat when Nick faltered because he had not been given enough time to adjust to their new life and prove to her that he still felt the same way for her. Hexenbiests aren't to be trusted obviously but I think it was important to Juliette to believe she wasn't alone at the time when the crap hit the fan. Now say they had a month instead to adjust to the new reality as opposed to the zero time they gave each other (I assume Adalind's powers returned approximately 3 to 6 months later), in that time, Nick would have been there by her side (knowing that the powers would return) assuring her that he wouldn't leave her or change her or whatever so when she became 100% biest, she wouldn't be angry over him and his treatment of her. This would have kept her emotions in check and HW wanting her help against BC could have been another option to visit since Trubel was already working for them she could vouch for them helping Juliette ward off her most destructive side effects of being a hexenbiest without destroyin the core of who she was.

Nick worked with human Juliette, why stop now that she's a hexenbiest? what they fear and what Nick actually does are two different things.

I chose to be more hopeful over her condition than the show allowed and yet Adalind was allowed to "change" in S5 as a result of taking the suppressant. And from what we've seen of Adalind since her powers returned is that she's not the same hexenbiest that tried to destroy Nick and almost killed his friends, why couldn't they do the same for Juliette before we got to this point, when it was possible to get her the help she needed before turning her into a monster? Cheap drama, that's why.

Ultimately, we see things VERY differently and that's that. I don't agree with any of what you said. You don't agree with anything I have said. Let's agree to disagree.

ok say Juliette had of taken the supression. During the three months what would they have been getting use to. Juliette would not have had the hexenbiest impulses or powers. And like Adalind when it wore off Juliette would have become a raging hexenbiest with no more ability to deal with it then when she first changed.
If suppressed the Kelly incident would not have happened. But something else would have set her off. The same that happened with Adalind. She was suppressed for months. Soon as it wore off she became a dangerous hexenbiest. Someone Nick was no more able or willing to deal with then he was with Juliette. With Adalind like he did with Juliette he became guarded, didn't trust her. You could see the tension building. Nick even said now she has her powers back. He did not want her to know about the tunnel or the stick.
So what actually did the suppression do for Adalind other then give her time to give birth.
Nick deals with Eve because of her training she does not give in to impulse. Now that she is cured I bet there will be conflict. The same will be true with Adalind.

Adalind got her powers back, she didn't become a raging hexenbiest going after everyone that wronged her after the suppressant wore off. She defended herself against Tony unwittingly as a sign of her powers returning. The worst she's done since then was threaten Sean and throw a vase at him after she moved in with him. Nick was wary of Adalind after discoving the return of her powers, he didn't trust that she wouldn't hurt him or whatever but Monroe and Rosalee talked some sense into him, imploring he wait it out and let Adalind come to him when she was able and that was because of Rosalee's experience with Post suppressant Adalind. Nick was made aware of Adalind's powers returning to her for days and he didn't run from her nor did he kick her out. In fact he had coitus with her as a hexenbiest.

Adalind knows about the tunnel but not the stick and that's largely due to Nick being a Grimm and the history around Grimms and Royals and that artifact as we saw from S1 till S3. The reason Nick didn't tell Adalind is not because of her powers but from needing to be cautious about something he had zero knowledge about that was a contentious issue since he became a Grimm. Not even HW knew about the stick and they are/were on the same side(ish) so i have no issues about Grimm Nick keeping secrets.

Hexenbiest are dangerous but they are clearly not that ALL THE TIME to everyone around them as we've seen with Henrietta, Elizabeth and now post suppressant Adalind. Their condition/behaviour can be controlled/managed if they chose to and I imagine that takes time. What I don't buy is foregoing that option and simply giving in to the violent nature when it didn't need to be that way at all.

You are correct that Juliette hexenbiest would still be triggered by something, my argument is that Nick wouldn't have been the source of her ire. It is very possible that she would have directed all of that rage elsewhere, not her boyfriend or friends and it could have been in a more productive manner as opposed to the destructive path she chose.

We know why Adalind took the suppressant. It was her meal ticket to ensuring her own safety plus that of her baby. It was never meant for her personally. She came to Nick and the scoobies as a fully functional hexenbiest in better control of her natural tendencies because she was driven by a greater instinct than doing bad things because of her powers and that was to make sure her baby would be safe from harm (homicidal Juliette). She told them it was a temporary solution to their immediate problem and they didn't trust her word so she used herself as a guinea pig. However long it lasted is what she was offering to Juliette and Nick (for her survival and not for altruistic reasons). She was inadvertently offering them time as opposed to no time at all.

Nick deals with Eve (and not Juliette) because that's what Juliette chose for him. She goaded him to the point where she knew he'd have to kill her but in the end he couldn't so she tried to kill him instead and Trubel tranq'ed her before she could. And now as Eve, she was a walking machine that couldn't stay away from the same guy she hurt and not for HW and their mission. Their relationship was meant to only be professional and Nick was more than happy to leave it at that after her insistance to not being Juliette but she kept pushing the boundaries that she set in place since before the end of S4. Juliette or Eve wanted it both ways.

I reiterate, all the horror that happened after Juliette turned could have been avoided. If Juliette is back as her emotional self but with powers, it will prove my point. I'd rather have avoided all of what happened if the end result is a Juliette that manages her hexenbiest powers.

Edit: They basically circled back to where they should have been, using hexenbiest Juliette as an equal to Nick but with a difference in that she was a "dangerous, despicable and untrustworthy" wesen that was fighting the same fight as a Grimm by his side (and as his lover/fiance/wife) to top it off. In the end all they succeeded in doing is make a character already unlikeable to a lot of people that much more detestable and wholly despised as a result. It all could have been avoided but here we all are....

Juliette looking to blame someone for what happened to him and there was Nick and his friends.
it happens that people are always looking to blame someone, and sometimes his family.or drop bombs or shoot.
Juliette became dangerous by how she felt.the Hexenbiest has a bad reputation because if the person hurts someone in your family can use her magic(curse him).I do not think Adalind hated him Nick so much.the affair with Marie and Hank was the brainchild of captain.Adalind lost his powers and his pride was hurt,wanted to take something from Nick.then she lost her baby, made the mad with sadness.she was overwhelmed by the love of mother( never thought would happen,if he would sell)
asked for help but told him that Renard asked gave it to Victor.very angry,sad.Victor took advantage.Adalid has matured, perhaps more with the loss of Diana

I agree. Juliette heightened feelings of anger towards those close to her were canon fodder for the hexenbiest within to lash out. She let it all get out of control because that was the easiest thing to do at the time when she felt abandoned by Nick and blamed Monroe and Rosalee for their part in making her the way she was however justified her feelings.

(10-21-2016, 02:15 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ]Adalind got her powers back, she didn't become a raging hexenbiest going after everyone that wronged her after the suppressant wore off.

Actually, she did. When she got her powers back, she went after Nick and the scoobies for taking Diana away from her. It also appears to me Adalind knew exactly what the scoobies would do trying to get Nick his powers back. She knew what would happen to Juliette as well.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I would call taking a Grimm's powers away from him and mutilating his girlfriend the acts of a raging hexenbiest. Juliette was a far more powerful hexenbiest and her actions against Nick pale in comparison to Adalind's.

(10-21-2016, 08:45 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-21-2016, 02:15 AM)rpmaluki Wrote: [ -> ]Adalind got her powers back, she didn't become a raging hexenbiest going after everyone that wronged her after the suppressant wore off.

Actually, she did. When she got her powers back, she went after Nick and the scoobies for taking Diana away from her. It also appears to me Adalind knew exactly what the scoobies would do trying to get Nick his powers back. She knew what would happen to Juliette as well.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I would call taking a Grimm's powers away from him and mutilating his girlfriend the acts of a raging hexenbiest. Juliette was a far more powerful hexenbiest and her actions against Nick pale in comparison to Adalind's.

That's not what happened. Adalind didn't take Nick's powers away because he kidnapped Diana. It happened as a result of kidnapping Diana but that's not why she did it. Adalind thought the Royals had Diana and even went to Nick to ask for his help in the very next episode.

Adalind actually didn't have any grudge towards Nick at the time. She only did it because Viktor told her she had to or she wouldn't see Diana again.

In addition, Adalind had no idea what would happen to Juliette. She didn't think that far ahead. Adalind probably thought Nick wouldn't regain his powers at all. She wouldn't have went to Nick's house and threatened Juliette if she knew that she had become a Hexenbiest. Adalind would've done something other than direct confrontation with her. She would've at least tried to get some Royal backup.

This is no defense what Adalind did. What happened to Juliette was a result of Adalind's actions although I get the sneaking suspicion that the writers tried to partially absolve her of it. Rosalee said that Juliette was paying the price for them taking Diana away from Adalind.

We're discussing motivations and not just the actions themselves. A couple of us have made the point that Juliette receives more scorn from fandom because she was one of the gang while Adalind was the enemy. I can't emphasize that enough!


Nick being with Adalind now is all types of messed up and giving her Juliette's car was stupid and insulting. All of this a result of Adalind having his child otherwise he wouldn't have anything to do with her. He treats her the way he does because she's Kelly's mother and he knows what it's like to lose his own. It happened twice! Nick doesn't want that for Kelly as long as Adalind is no threat to him. It was never necessary for him to have an intimate relationship with her which is where all the twisted stuff comes in but he felt like he had to treat her civilly and protect her for Kelly's sake. He just happened to develop feelings for Adalind as her got to know her along the way. It doesn't excuse him for being the buffoon he is though.

(10-21-2016, 09:33 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: [ -> ]That's not what happened. Adalind didn't take Nick's powers away because he kidnapped Diana. It happened as a result of kidnapping Diana but that's not why she did it.

Then Adalind must be a liar. In the police precinct she told Nick she did what she did to him because he took her child away from her.