02-22-2018, 12:19 PM
(This post was last modified: 02-22-2018, 12:30 PM by dicappatore.)
(02-22-2018, 07:49 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote:(02-21-2018, 11:12 PM)dicappatore Wrote:@dicappatore You are right the Rolek question does not change the series. The reason for the post is to question Rolek did it but how. We know Rolek dad was like Kelly or maybe more like Aunt Marie (killing only bad wesen) but he did kill IMO I see the Rolek as example of one Grimm who rejected being a Grimm. You did ask the right question why?(02-21-2018, 12:37 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: In Nick's case, the wilderness analogy works a lot better if the wesen are the hikers panicking when they see the snake. The ones who survive the encounter are the ones who are smart enough not to try attacking.
(02-21-2018, 07:52 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:(02-21-2018, 05:06 PM)irukandji Wrote:(02-21-2018, 10:01 AM)eric Wrote: I didn't say the boa is attacking you, I said it got in your boat, maybe to catch a few rays, what do you do? Admire the skin pattern or kill it--honestly now, really? And don't say jump in the water, there are alligators there. I say the wessen have only two choices--fight or flight. Grimms have the advantage that the wessen fear them, all the way down to the bone.
Okay, this is what I get out of your analogy. Person in boat=grimm. Boa=wesen.
The boa, according to this analogy, has three choices. It can attack, it can simply sun itself, or it can go back to whence it came. Right?
The person, on the other hand, has no choice. You've removed the option of escape. I don't count watching the boa sun itself because the boat is the person's territory. Said boa has come into the territory and poses a threat. The only option available to the person is to defend their boat against the invader.
A grimm may be put into the position where the only method of defense is to kill. I'm not saying that could never happen. I'm just saying that I believe there have been encounters between wesen and grimms that didn't result in death or injury. Instead both were intelligent enough to assess the futility of death and decided to simply leave one another alone.
(02-21-2018, 10:22 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: In order to continue this debate, I think we really need to see some example on the show where Nick killed a wesen without provocation. That was thrown out there earlier so there needs to be some proof that anyone can provide if that's true.
Is this question in regard to something I wrote?
I think he was describing Grimms as the Boa rather than the wesen. He was explaining how wesen see Grimms and why they attack them.
As for the question, it was in response to you saying:
(02-20-2018, 07:36 PM)irukandji Wrote: Here's what I see with Eric's analogy; wesen who woge automatically present a deadly threat. Nick, grimm hunter, is justified in killing said wesen. There's no room for choices. That's it, plain and simple.
It could be that you were saying that as an analysis of his analogy rather than your own opinion so I'll retract what I said if that's case.
If not, then I made a request for proof. That really isn't what he said in his analogy because he was talking about how wesen see Grimms.
Quote:Okay, I apologize, I am sorry, I failed to be clear in my writing. I will try to be more precise in the future. The wolf in the woods, the boa in the boat I meant to be a Grimm. "You" in the woods and the boat and all the wessen we saw in the show were wessen who had just met their childhood monsters who would kill them if they woged. My belief is that any sane wessen either fled or tried to kill the GRIMM on the spot before he/she could kill them. I still do not understand how Rolex could have lived to his advanced age without upsetting some folks in his area. There, Iruk, am I being clear enough, or do I have to try again? Waiting for reply.
Talk about someone redirecting a lost argument. This is the mother of all "skewing the subject line". First, to reply to the redirection of the subject line. There are no needs for any "walk in the woods" or "snake in the boat analogies". You have all the proof on the screen of the show we were all watching. Take the Pilot Episode. Nick wasn't even aware of his Grimm yet when a Blutbad decided to start hunting young women and little girls.
Did Nick set him off when he got nervous in his presence and caused him to get the urge to kill? I don't think so. We also learn in this episode, Grimms can't turn it off, as some un-attentative, un-factual opinionated contributor claimed. This Wesen KILLED innocent humans. Why would you need an analogy for that? It is pretty clear. Bad Wesen kills innocent humans. Does the presence of a two Grimms in Portland make this happen? Nick is a homicide detective. He investigates homicides. Not because he is a Grimm.
Now as for the attempted murder of his Aunt Marie? Did she initiate the killings of the Reaper Wesen that came after her? Did she attack Sean, Adalind or the Reaper Hulda that attacked his aunt. Just a few more cases, early on the series to set the stage. Wesen are bad, humans are their pray and Grimms are the good guys! And many other times, the victims are also Wesen, which Nick comes to their rescue. Not the other way around. No matter how many times they try to make the Wesen as the victims and the Grimm as the bad guys, on a show called "Grimm". This must be making this contributor stomp their feet and yell in anger, like a small spoiled child.
Now, going back to the subject at hand with Rolek. How he lived the life of a Grimm under the radar would be a whole other spin-off. As far as this series goes, it is not a pertinent factor. My question to jsgrimm45 is, how would the "how and why", "Rolek Porter how did he live under the Wesen radar", effect or change any of the outcome of the show? Why is the reasons on how and why change anything?
The big redirection of the subject of this thread is a result of someone trying to impose the life of Rolek on the main character Nick. Somehow, to this "Nick Loather", Rolek's lifestyle choice, as a Grimm, would clean up Nicks corrupt and evil ways. This is how far some will go to, after many exhausting failed attempts falling on deaf ears.
BTW? That Blutbad that was killed in that 1st episode? He wasn't killed by Nick. He was shot by Hank.
You can join the military as a CO and work as say a Medic, but as a Medic you are in the same danger as the grunt next to you. We did see Rolek kill a wesen so he could do it to save his son. So was he a CO against all violence no but against most yes.
When we get to NIck his job put in connect with mostly bad wesen, question what kind of job would Rolek have that didn't, also how would the wesen he no doubt came in connect with react at the knowledge the he was a Grimm? How might he defuse the connect? we seen Nick defuse wesen all the time did Rolek do the same?
js, the point I am trying to make has nothing to do with your question to debate what you asked. It is a valid subject to explore and I welcome all the ideas besides mines, to discus. Just my answer to it was rather simple and concise.
What I am trying to pointing out, is how the subject gets re-directed to the same old claims, AGAIN Nick being the bad guy. These few, and I do mean "Few", contributor just can't get it through their thick skull, the show is about a Grimm, not Juliette! Even as Eve, she isn't the main focus of the show. She is still the supporting cast. She isn't even a primary support character. She falls behind Hank, Monroe and even Sean and maybe Adalind.
Then they try to make Nick be the bad guy and Juliette his victim instead of her becoming an evil bitch, by her choice. Does it matter if the Hex in her made her do it? Does it matter if Adalind caused it to happen? She still did it. Shoot, now I am skewing. At least I admit it.
The story line isn't that complicated, the way it is told. Given the fantasy world they created, is. I haven't read all of the Grimm tales but I am told, Grimms were on the good side. They just had a bad way to confront their objectives, since the Wesen were worse.
One of the insulting comparison they try to make is the constant references to the Grimms of the past to present day Nick. As if he is one of the same Grimm from a few centuries before him. The other is how they skew the subject and then try to accuse or point at others of what they do themselves..
I am sure there will be more re-directions of subjects posted on these threads. And I will be here to remind them, when they put their feet in their mouths.
You know you are OLD, when you see the Slide Ruler you used in college selling in an ANTIQUE SHOP!!