Greetings Forum,
I have been reading today's posts. It seems (and I agree) that what should be lively, intelligent debate on the Forum turns into hostile personal attacks. Several Forum members have expressed a desire that we be more cordial and I agree.
That said, I wish to return to discussion about the topic of this thread, "What Juliette 'Knew': Kelly's death."
In criminal and civil law, guilt is proven by "Weight of Evidence."
https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictiona...f+evidence
As a Police Detective, Nick has an understanding of "evidence" and how it is used in a trial. As a Grimm, Nick at times serves as judge, jury and executioner.
As viewers, we have access to more factual evidence than Nick. At the end of 4.21, "Headache" the evidence Nick has is his mother's recently severed head in a box. Trubel and Hank also view the "evidence." It is a fact that she has been brutally murdered. Nick has several other facts available to assemble evidence and bring the guilty perpetrators to justice.
In 4.22, "Cry Havoc" Nick and the Scoobies prepare an assault on the perpetrators and Trubel asks:
IMO, Nick holds Juliette responsible for the murder of his mother. That is why he told the Scoobies to "kill her." Note also that none of them questioned his order. Note that it is after she tells him "I didn't know Kenneth was gonna do that" when he grabs her by the throat and beguns to strangle her. IMO, Nick heard that as a total lie. In addition, he confronts FrankenEve saying "you set up my mother."
Nick could tell she had used his computer, but we saw the actual email. Nick knew she had been with Kenneth, but we saw and heard her in the hotel giving intel about the neighbors while the Verrat loaded guns. We saw more evidence of her involvement than Nick.
The factual evidence is compelling. It seems that Nick, using less evidence than viewers had, found her guilty of murder. Juliette's statements " Do it, Nick. Kill me. Just do it. Do it." and "You should have killed me when you had the chance." could indicate she knows her guilt and deserves to die for what she did.
N G
I have been reading today's posts. It seems (and I agree) that what should be lively, intelligent debate on the Forum turns into hostile personal attacks. Several Forum members have expressed a desire that we be more cordial and I agree.
That said, I wish to return to discussion about the topic of this thread, "What Juliette 'Knew': Kelly's death."
In criminal and civil law, guilt is proven by "Weight of Evidence."
https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictiona...f+evidence
As a Police Detective, Nick has an understanding of "evidence" and how it is used in a trial. As a Grimm, Nick at times serves as judge, jury and executioner.
As viewers, we have access to more factual evidence than Nick. At the end of 4.21, "Headache" the evidence Nick has is his mother's recently severed head in a box. Trubel and Hank also view the "evidence." It is a fact that she has been brutally murdered. Nick has several other facts available to assemble evidence and bring the guilty perpetrators to justice.
In 4.22, "Cry Havoc" Nick and the Scoobies prepare an assault on the perpetrators and Trubel asks:
Quote:Trubel: Nick, if we do find Juliette, what do you want us to do?Then at the end of the episode Nick returns to his home and Juliette shows up:
Nick: Kill her.
Quote:Juliette: I didn't know Kenneth was gonna do that.In 5.07, "Eve of Destruction" Nick has a brief chat with FrankenEve including:
Nick: She trusted you.
Juliette: I know. I thought they just wanted Diana.
Nick: You betrayed her! [He grabs her and pins her against a wall to choke her]
Juliette: [Gasping] Do it, Nick. Kill me. Just do it. Do it. [She gasps more. Nick lets go of her and she catches her breath] You can't put me out of your misery, huh? I hope you're not going to tell me you're still in love with me.
Nick: Get out.
Juliette: After everything I've done for you, you think that's how we're gonna end it? You should have killed me when you had the chance.
Quote:Nick: [He goes inside and looks around until he spots Juliette sitting in the back. He pauses and then goes to her table. He sighs] I thought you were dead. [He sits down and exhales] Oh, Juliette.As viewers, we have additional evidence. Several Forum members have posted such evidence.
Eve: My name isn't Juliette.
Nick: What am I supposed to call you?
Eve: They call me Eve.
Nick: Why Eve?
Eve: Because I'm starting over.
Nick: Do you really think it's that easy?
Eve: It wasn't easy.
Nick: You want to know what isn't easy? Knowing that you set me up... and that you set up my mother. What, are you gonna pretend like you don't remember?
Eve: I remember everything. I would have killed you.
IMO, Nick holds Juliette responsible for the murder of his mother. That is why he told the Scoobies to "kill her." Note also that none of them questioned his order. Note that it is after she tells him "I didn't know Kenneth was gonna do that" when he grabs her by the throat and beguns to strangle her. IMO, Nick heard that as a total lie. In addition, he confronts FrankenEve saying "you set up my mother."
Nick could tell she had used his computer, but we saw the actual email. Nick knew she had been with Kenneth, but we saw and heard her in the hotel giving intel about the neighbors while the Verrat loaded guns. We saw more evidence of her involvement than Nick.
The factual evidence is compelling. It seems that Nick, using less evidence than viewers had, found her guilty of murder. Juliette's statements " Do it, Nick. Kill me. Just do it. Do it." and "You should have killed me when you had the chance." could indicate she knows her guilt and deserves to die for what she did.
N G