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+--- Thread: "Good Intentions" in Grimm (/Thread-Good-Intentions-in-Grimm)
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - Hell Rell - 01-08-2019
(01-08-2019, 11:11 AM)irukandji Wrote:(01-08-2019, 10:31 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: If you were to ask me, I'd have no problem with Adalind using her skills to get what she wants and it may make the story more interesting but that's not how her character was written in the last couple of seasons.
The issue with your response is that you are assuming Adalind is using her manipulation skills for evil purposes. Therefore, you're implying she is not using her manipulation skills because she isn't doing anything evil. Correct?
I'm saying Adalind didn't use any type of manipulation on Nick. I think there are times where I would've preferred her to and show some fire like the old Adalind but she was always genuine with him. She didn't even manipulate him into bed. She was actually being sincere when she said she was scared of sleeping alone and felt safer with Nick in the room with her because he could kill anything that walked through that door.
Throughout the last two seasons, I saw Adalind being genuine with her feelings when she talked to Nick. She won Nick over by not being a manipulative Hexenbiest.
The only time I saw Adalind even try to be manipulative was with Renard in season 6 so she could buy time for the gang. And even then it was clear she wasn't her old self because she wasn't very good at it.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - syscrash - 01-08-2019
Quote:Did they have as much scenes or moments togther as Monroe and Rosalee or Juliette and Nick clearly not however your once again camparing apples and organes, Nick and Adalind have only been a proper couple from season 6Time has nothing to do with it. Had the show wanted it to be a loving relationship and not just living together they could have. My point is the writer choose how events are shown. The writers choose to show ADalind doing and making decisions the same as she did when we know she was being manipulative. I used Hank to show the writers having Adalind showing sincerity when we know there was none. You even sight what Clair said in interviews. Even though her statements where how she saw the character she was playing. that had nothing to do with what the writers created.
If you read my other post I admit the writers use a lot of ambiguity, letting the viewers see things in different ways. But that does not change the writers structuring scenes to support the idea. She is a hexenbiest and will always be a hexenbest meaning her nature is to be manipulative and self serving. Even from a story telling view. What would explain her changing how she thinks. If the writers wanted us to have no doubt Nick and ADalind was a loving relationship. If the writers wanted us to have no doubts Adalind was being sincere. Why not write a scene showing Adalind is truly in love with Nick. they did it for Monroee and Rosalee. They did it for Nick and Juliette. Instead you continually sight things that infer love. You give reasoning why things did not happen a certain way. forgetting a writer can writer to overcome any an all restriction and limitations to make a point. For example when Monroee got back there was a heart warming reunion. Compare that with Nick and Adalind. The first thing Monroee did was go to Rosalee, not Nick. Again you can provide all the reasoning you want. But that event like others where written in a way you could see a difference.
Quote:No I don’t only see what I want this is not a subtle show when someone is being manipulated they make it clear like Adalind minipulating Hank in season 1 and Renard In season 3 and Nick in 4x19You can also say the same about how they show a loving Relationship. We have plenty of scenes between Monroee and rosalee, or Nick and Juliette that leaves no doubt. With Nick and Adalind They do not make it clear one way or the other. The one thing that is consistent. All the way to the end everything benefited her. Yes it helped other, what see saw as best for her kids.
You people are right it is not a subtle show. yet you can not sight one scene that eliminates all doubt. You see the police station as manipulation. Because the other actions where more self serving people don't see it as manipulation.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - irukandji - 01-08-2019
(01-08-2019, 02:12 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: Throughout the last two seasons, I saw Adalind being genuine with her feelings when she talked to Nick. She won Nick over by not being a manipulative Hexenbiest.
What would be the point in responding to your question then? You've already stated that you saw Adalind as being genuine.
(01-08-2019, 02:12 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: She was actually being sincere when she said she was scared of sleeping alone and felt safer with Nick in the room with her because he could kill anything that walked through that door.
Sincere in what way? Adalind slept perfectly fine by herself in Nick's former house and that would have been a far more frightening place than being secure two floors up in a warehouse. She had nothing to be afraid of. You wanted an example of hexenbiest manipulation after season four. There it is.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - brandon - 01-08-2019
Because in the book said that they-" Hexenbiest"- are manipulators, that does not apply to all.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - irukandji - 01-08-2019
(01-08-2019, 04:59 PM)brandon Wrote: Because in the book said that they-" Hexenbiest"- are manipulators, that does not apply to all.
In what way does it not apply to all?
(01-08-2019, 02:00 PM)N_grimm Wrote: As Adalind told Renard: "I'm not the same Hexenbiest anymore".
Then she's talking out of both sides of her mouth because she described to Rosalee how the hexenbiest controlled her. That tells me that she's the same hexenbiest she always was.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - FaceInTheCrowd - 01-08-2019
Adalind told Rosalee about her fears that being a hexenbiest would change her if it came back. Obviously, it didn't. But that shouldn't be any surprise, because losing it in S01 and getting it back in S02 didn't change her either. The thing that really seemed to change her was motherhood.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - Hell Rell - 01-08-2019
(01-08-2019, 04:59 PM)irukandji Wrote:(01-08-2019, 02:12 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: Throughout the last two seasons, I saw Adalind being genuine with her feelings when she talked to Nick. She won Nick over by not being a manipulative Hexenbiest.
What would be the point in responding to your question then? You've already stated that you saw Adalind as being genuine.
(01-08-2019, 02:12 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: She was actually being sincere when she said she was scared of sleeping alone and felt safer with Nick in the room with her because he could kill anything that walked through that door.
Sincere in what way? Adalind slept perfectly fine by herself in Nick's former house and that would have been a far more frightening place than being secure two floors up in a warehouse. She had nothing to be afraid of. You wanted an example of hexenbiest manipulation after season four. There it is.
We clearly disagree on on her being genuine vs. her being manipulative using the same examples. I gave you an example of something I knew you would point to and I'm saying there was nothing shown to tell us she was lying in the slightest. I guess there really is no reason for us to respond to each other as far as this subject is concerned.
As for Adalind being afraid in the warehouse, it was patently clear she was afraid or at least paranoid. You can say she had no reason to be afraid but she obviously didn't feel that way. Adalind was in a dreary warehouse she had never been in before and got frightened being in unfamiliar territory for the first time. Adalind, the character, would disagree with you about having nothing to be afraid of and Nick never questioned it himself. You said she was secure but she obviously didn't feel this way. From an objective standpoint, she was safe but that's not what matters here. That doesn't make her feelings any less real.
Besides, Adalind didn't even have her Hexenbiest at this point.
(01-08-2019, 06:32 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: Adalind told Rosalee about her fears that being a hexenbiest would change her if it came back. Obviously, it didn't. But that shouldn't be any surprise, because losing it in S01 and getting it back in S02 didn't change her either. The thing that really seemed to change her was motherhood.
This will keep falling on deaf ears. The generic Hexenbiest now matters more than Adalind as an individual. She may as well not be a character that we followed for six years and just be thought of as a typical WotW.
I guess we can also say that Rosalee is putting on an act as well. From the way Monroe initially described Fuchsbau, there's no way Rosalee is the real deal. We should also be highly suspicious of Juliette's friend as well.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - dicappatore - 01-08-2019
ROFLMAO. Its funny how in the past I have been accused of the inability to come up with controversial post to contribute to this forum, and I apologize. How much more can be argued?
At least I don't come up with re-re-hashing old arguments like some other contributors, since I do have a life.
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - irukandji - 01-08-2019
(01-08-2019, 07:33 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: Adalind, the character, would disagree with you about having nothing to be afraid of and Nick never questioned it himself. You said she was secure but she obviously didn't feel this way. From an objective standpoint, she was safe but that's not what matters here. That doesn't make her feelings any less real.
Adalind, the character, might just disagree with you. I don't recall her showing any fear during the entire series run. Allow me to question why, when she finally gets the protection she wants from the man she bargained with, does she suddenly show fear when Nick's in the next room and....how did you put it? He could kill anything that came through her door. Tell me how that works.
(01-08-2019, 07:33 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: This will keep falling on deaf ears. The generic Hexenbiest now matters more than Adalind as an individual. She may as well not be a character that we followed for six years and just be thought of as a typical WotW.
I guess we can also say that Rosalee is putting on an act as well. From the way Monroe initially described Fuchsbau, there's no way Rosalee is the real deal. We should also be highly suspicious of Juliette's friend as well.
You're all up in arms about Adalind's feelings and how sincere she is now and how she would never manipulate anyone, ever. How about talking about Hank. Does Adalind matter more to him as an individual or does he still look upon her as a hexenbiest?
RE: "Good Intentions" in Grimm - Henry of green - 01-08-2019
(01-08-2019, 10:02 PM)irukandji Wrote:(01-08-2019, 07:33 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: Adalind, the character, would disagree with you about having nothing to be afraid of and Nick never questioned it himself. You said she was secure but she obviously didn't feel this way. From an objective standpoint, she was safe but that's not what matters here. That doesn't make her feelings any less real.
Adalind, the character, might just disagree with you. I don't recall her showing any fear during the entire series run. Allow me to question why, when she finally gets the protection she wants from the man she bargained with, does she suddenly show fear when Nick's in the next room and....how did you put it? He could kill anything that came through her door. Tell me how that works.
(01-08-2019, 07:33 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: This will keep falling on deaf ears. The generic Hexenbiest now matters more than Adalind as an individual. She may as well not be a character that we followed for six years and just be thought of as a typical WotW.
I guess we can also say that Rosalee is putting on an act as well. From the way Monroe initially described Fuchsbau, there's no way Rosalee is the real deal. We should also be highly suspicious of Juliette's friend as well.
You're all up in arms about Adalind's feelings and how sincere she is now and how she would never manipulate anyone, ever. How about talking about Hank. Does Adalind matter more to him as an individual or does he still look upon her as a hexenbiest?
How on earth has Adalind never shown fear, she was truly terrified in episode 3 of season 1 when the melifiers were after her, she was so fearful you could see it in her face when the bees attacked and Nick and Hank were in the other room trying to keep the bees out. Adalinds hand was trembling and fingers twitching when Nick confronted her about his aunts murder also in that 1x03 episode.
She was terrified in 1x17 when she lost her powers she even asked her mom and Renard what they will do to her and she cried like a baby.
She was terrified also terrified when her and Miesner were on the run with baby Diana,
She was terrified and crying like a baby when viktor threw her in the dungeon in season 4.
She was terrified when Juliette kicked her ass in 4x13 and she was terrified of Juliette in the station.
Fear and being a drama queen has also been part of Adalinds character so your above statement makes zero sense.