(04-06-2017, 08:46 PM)MANTItotheCore Wrote: Thanks! I really like the Manticore wessen.

(04-06-2017, 08:46 PM)MANTItotheCore Wrote: I appreciate your taking the time to explain it and it seems reasonable.

For my part, from the moment Ken asked Juliette to dupe Kelly into coming to 'rescue' Nick, bringing Diana, that it was going to end any other way than with Kelly's death. No chance Kelly gives up Diana willingly. They would have to take her and Kelly's not going to survive the encounter. I mean, did you think they would knock her out, take Diana, and then leave Kelly alive?

My problem is that Juliette could have used her MOST awesome Hexy powers and stopped them from killing Kelly, but she waited until it was over and Kelly was dead.

(04-06-2017, 06:19 PM)irukandji Wrote: I was simply pointing out ways in which Adalind could ingratiate herself in order to get into Nick's good graces. According to some of the comments here, Adalind was desperate. If she is that desperate, then it's not out of her realm to use whatever means she can to get Nick's protection and a safe haven.

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(04-06-2017, 06:11 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:

(04-06-2017, 05:58 PM)irukandji Wrote: If you're going to do something of this nature, I ask that you point out all of the so called misrepresentations and not just singling out my comments. That's not very sporting and is a misrepresentation in itself.

How so? You're comments are the ones I singled out because no one else said that they aren't concerned with Adalind attempting to kill Marie as you claim. That was the misrepresentation because you say they did.

I'll tell you what this really is. You're ticked because I'm making comments about Adalind without bringing Sean into it and you feel that's unfair. These recent posts about misrepresentations and singling out my comments specifically are nothing more than a diversion tactic. Deny it all you want but that is exactly what you're doing.

(04-06-2017, 09:10 PM)irukandji Wrote: Honestly, I believe Juliette was the patsy in all of this. I'm not excusing her actions, but I don't believe that only Kenneth knew of her email. HW was closely monitoring everything and I have a feeling they were tipped off, possibly by Kelly herself.

(04-06-2017, 08:33 AM)irukandji Wrote:

(04-06-2017, 07:36 AM)Mrtrick Wrote: Sean sent Adalind to try and kill Marie, but she was unsuccessful because Nick recognized her. Marie didn't even know about it because she was unconcious at the time. And when Adalind cursed Hank, Nick did go after her. They had a huge fight, in which Adalind lost her powers. And if Nick chooses not kill her at the time, it's because in those early years, he was still very much in cop mode. Not to mention the fact that Nick has never been the sort to kill a defenseless woman, which she was by that point. Lastly, when Juliette was put under a sleeping curse, Adalind made quick tracks to Europe. Nick tried to find her, but couldn't. Had he caught up to her, maybe it goes badly, but that's a road untraveled. By the time Adalind was back in town, Juliette was alive and well, (relatively speaking), so Nick's anger had abated. He certainly hated her guts, but he wasn't going to try and murder her for something that almost happened.

If Nick was weirded out by Juliette as a Hexenbeist, it's as much because of what Adalind had done, as it was was the shock of seeing her face turn into this frightening visage. At this point, Nick still had the traditional Grimm view of the Hexenbeist. And Juliette wasn't exactly comforting about it, rubbing it in his face. Nothing that happened over the next few weeks would help to assuage those jaundiced opinions. Nick did everything he could to bring Juliette back, but she was fighting him at every turn. Even after Kelly's death he couldn't bring himself to kill her. Trubel had to pull the trigger.

What happened with Adalind is so much more complicated than hooking up with her because she was having his baby. It begins with the fact that Adalind had been slowly and subtly changing for quite some time. From pregnancy onward, she had been working her way back to a buried humanity. Even after becoming a Hexenbeist again, those changes continued. I've always believed that the Hexenbeist within her had been slowly chipped away by a series of events. Sharing that power with Diana. Turning into Juliette and creating a magical connection to Nick. Having Juliette take a portion of that power for herself. It all had the effect of removing the Hexenbeist influence on Adalind's psyche. By the time she willingly gives up that power to create the suppressant, Adalind is already a changed woman. She just doesn't know it yet. The rest is an emotional armor that she had been building for herself since childhood. Her mother had wanted to mold her in her own image, and though she tried to buck that path, by the time we meet her, that's exactly who she's become. An object for powerful men like Sean Renard and the Royals to use out of lust and a desire for influence and control. Her entire journey over the first four seasons, (though she doesn't realize it), is to break free of that path.

When Nick is confronted with a pregnant Adalind, what else can he do but protect her. That's his child inside of her. Neither of their views of each other has changed at this point. He doesn't trust her. She's still afraid of him. But once that Hexenbeist side of her is suppressed, he can't keep looking at her as an enemy, but as a pregnant woman. One he needs to take care of. From a male perspective, that's an almost instinctual reaction. Once the fight was finished, and they had time to consider what was happening in their lives, they had no choice but to lean on each other. With a baby to look after and threats still looming, they had to huddle together. Inspite of their past, an intimacy inevitably developed. They had to get to know each other as people instead of archetypes. It had to shock both of them when they realized that they actually liked each other. Knowing her as a person and learning to care about her had a lasting effect on his whole view of the Hexenbeist issue. When she got her powers back, it didn't change her personality or her loyalty to him, so Nick never had a reason to fall back on old prejudices. For Adalind, falling in love with Nick was easy because she found herself living with a man who was kind and protective. A man who cared about her and respected her in a way that no man probably ever had in her whole life. An actual Knight in shining armor and loving father, which she probably doubted existed. For Nick, it was like living with a completely different woman. Atleast, different from any of his expectations. She was warm and supportive. They never bickered about anything. She became and unexpected foundation for him in turbulent times. Recognizing it as love was a slower process for Nick, but she just kept surprising him. Seeing her, day in and day out, as a loving and patient mother also had a massive impact on his evolving affection for her. He told Monroe once, before he had slept with Adalind, that it all seemed so "strangely normal". Eventually it stopped being strange to him at all. If you want to blame someone or something for what happened between them, blame fate. It forced them to view the world and each other differently. People do get to change, for better or worse. They just underwent a positive one. And for all her pain, Eve is where she's meant to be as well. She said she wouldn't change things if she could. That applies to Nick and Adalind as well as herself.

Doesn't all this tell you that the series was biased toward Adalind?

(04-06-2017, 09:01 AM)Tara Wrote:

(04-06-2017, 08:47 AM)irukandji Wrote:

(04-06-2017, 08:39 AM)Tara Wrote: And who is to blame for the break up? Would Nick and Juliette separate if Adalind wouldn't have done it? The answer is NO

You know, you really have to wonder at Nick's mentality over the breakup and subsequent move toward Adalind. She's (and excuse my language here) continually s**t on him. Yet he still gravitates toward her because she's sporting his child? Weird guy.

On the other hand, it could simply be looked at as one more step in putting them together.

irukandji, This is the same thing I think. It feels forced and somehow not right. If it's for the sake of Kelly. They do not need to be together. But For me Nadalind is a red cloth. I just can not make friends with them. But this is probably due to the fact that I prefer Nickliette more.

I don't say I don't like Adalind as Character I just say I don't belief Nadalind.

(04-06-2017, 10:26 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: You weren't using what Adalind could do to get Nick as a hypothetical. You presented your thoughts like that was what actually happened on the show. That's what I was disagreeing with in my argument and wondering how Adalind had a scheme to take Nick away from Juliette.

I can guarantee you that this is not a diversion tactic. You're making up a narrative of Adalind going to Nick for anything other than protection. I'm pointing out how there has been nothing in the show to support it.

This was really about you saying people were unconcerned about Adalind attempting to kill Marie when no one did. Saying I'm trying to create a diversion is another misrepresentation.

As for the topic at hand, I'm one of the people who has said that Adalind did rape Nick. I'm not some Adalind apologist just for anyone who may think that, not including you on this one.

(04-07-2017, 03:51 AM)Purity Wrote: You know, watching all through the seasons, Juliette from all the friends of Nick, she was the only one to deprive Nick of his destiny and who he is. She even called thier relationship an infection all just because of who he is "something he never asked for but had it for was meant to be".
Juliette's relationship was a stand still, always pulled Nick backwards, he could not move forward. Even in S6, he is still stuck in the past with a guilt trip as she was.
Adalind on the other hand, she understood him better and made him understand/ believe he had purpose, she never held him down, only then Nick realising his life with her was moving forward with positive perspectives.

Ofcource the Nadalind relationship was the better of the 2. In a Grimm way, it was healthier for Nick than when he was with Juliette.

(04-07-2017, 03:51 AM)Purity Wrote: You know, watching all through the seasons, Juliette from all the friends of Nick, she was the only one to deprive Nick of his destiny and who he is. She even called thier relationship an infection all just because of who he is "something he never asked for but had it for was meant to be".

(04-07-2017, 10:01 AM)Tara Wrote: Sure thing, Nadalind is healthy - not that I laugh, sarcasm out.

Juliette did everything for Nick out of Love. And what did Adalind?