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+--- Thread: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm (/Thread-Injustice-done-to-the-Juliette-s-character-in-Grimm)
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - brandon - 03-05-2017
I think Eve would not wear anything from the wardrobe of Juliette. She is someone else. I liked his capping sky blue color- Juliette-. I think she dresses according to the function she fulfills. Just like office people wear suit and not strident colors.
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - New Guy - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 06:10 AM)syscrash Wrote: He is one of the statments G&K made.Syscrash,
TVLINE | David and Jim, how long have you known you were going to bring Bitsie back?
GREENWALT | A long time… But to keep my word, [Juliette] is dead. She’s coming back, but it’s not really Juliette anymore. It’s this new character, Eve, who has not been brainwashed exactly, but she’s been through some incredibly tough training where they broke her down to nothing.
She has a big scene with Nick in Episode 7, and she’s just a completely different person who doesn’t even relate to Juliette anymore — because, to her, Juliette’s dead.
TVLINE | Does she know who Nick is?
GREENWALT | She knows who Nick is, she knows what happened, and it all gets explained, what happened the night that Trubel shot her in the chest and neck with the arrows.
LIke I keep saying Juliette is dead. But as these statement show the person that was Juliette has been changed. She has every thing that Juliette had except the personality and the emotions.
Thanks for the quote:
Quote:GREENWALT | … But to keep my word, [Juliette] is dead.So where does Greenwalt recant her actual death and say it was a metaphorical death? He makes it clear that Juliette is dead.
Was Patrick Shelley's death also just a metaphor since the doctors Frankensteinized him? IMO, G&K like to play with death and since they continue to confirm Juliette died and that the character in season 6 is FrankenEve. That is why Greenwalt emphasizes "But to keep my word" when he again confirms " [Juliette] is dead." No metaphor.
N G
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - Robyn - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 09:38 AM)irukandji Wrote: The absolute worst example of this was the nonsense about Eve having to change into Renard's form so she could doing her spy work.I didn’t pay much attention to how they dressed Eve, other than it was basically a La Femme Nikita stereotype. So not much thinking put into it, except the male fantasy mindset.
The biggest problem for me was that Juliette was beaten down, mentally fractured into an asset/killing machine whose only aspiration was fighting HW’s mission. She didn’t express any needs/desires as a woman/individual. And when the Eve character ran it's course, the show stick whammied her, basically setting her back into the Juliette personality who looks to Nick for direction.
So pretty much, Juliette and Adalind are either Nick’s adversaries who everyone hates or they’re dependent on him, and liked & accepted by the group.
The show seems to rely on Adalind’s fashion statement to indicate whether her intentions are good or bad. MarylikesGrimm commented that because photos in later episodes show Adalind dressing the way she does when with Renard, she assumed Adalind was back with Renard during those episodes.
Renard believed he and Adalind were discussing Diana’s education & socials needs, and seemed to agree those things needed to be addressed. But. Adalind was conning Renard into staying at the mansion while Nick impersonated him. So technically, she wasn’t showing more concern/interest in Diana’s needs than she has Kelly’s. I don’t think Adalind contemplates about the next day, much less the future. Adalind might have a little Scarlett O'Hara in her - “I’ll think about that tomorrow.”
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - irukandji - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 11:12 AM)Robyn Wrote: I didn’t pay much attention to how they dressed Eve, other than it was basically a La Femme Nikita stereotype. So not much thinking put into it, except the male fantasy mindset.
I don't know La Femme Nikita, only that it was a series that aired years ago.
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - Robyn - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 11:29 AM)irukandji Wrote: I don't know La Femme Nikita, only that it was a series that aired years ago.It’s not just that character, it’s who I thought of when I first saw Eve. Basically a woman in skintight leather equates to kickass. So male fantasy, cliché, a creative team who only thinks inside the box….
But here’s the thing, the attire doesn’t really matter if Eve had her own sense of self. Baggy sweats or skintight leather, Eve should have needed/wanted more than the mission. Who knows what it was supposed to mean, but Meisner was shown daydreaming about Adalind during his down time. Why not Eve?
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - irukandji - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 11:40 AM)Robyn Wrote:(03-05-2017, 11:29 AM)irukandji Wrote: I don't know La Femme Nikita, only that it was a series that aired years ago.It’s not just that character, it’s who I thought of when I first saw Eve. Basically a woman in skintight leather equates to kickass. So male fantasy, cliché, a creative team who only thinks inside the box….
But here’s the thing, the attire doesn’t really matter if Eve had her own sense of self. Baggy sweats or skintight leather, Eve should have needed/wanted more than the mission. Who knows what it was supposed to mean, but Meisner was shown daydreaming about Adalind during his down time. Why not Eve?
My thought it that by making Eve a badass soldier, the creative team wasn't trying to sex her up, but masculinize her. I went to look up La Femme Nikita and while the premise is very similar, she dressed quite provocatively. I never considered Eve's getup provocative at all. In fact, her dress and Trubel's reminded me a lot of the way Nick dressed.
That was my point of bringing up dress in the first place. I get the impression that the creative team was trying to masculinize the women of Grimm, including their manner of dress.
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - Robyn - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 12:19 PM)irukandji Wrote: My thought it that by making Eve a badass soldier, the creative team wasn't trying to sex her up, but masculinize her. I went to look up La Femme Nikita and while the premise is very similar, she dressed quite provocatively. I never considered Eve's getup provocative at all. In fact, her dress and Trubel's reminded me a lot of the way Nick dressed.
That was my point of bringing up dress in the first place. I get the impression that the creative team was trying to masculinize the women of Grimm, including their manner of dress.
Well, that could be it. I never thought much about Juliette’s or Trubel’s sexuality before, but when you brought up the possibility of Juliette pregnant by Meisner, I thought then that Eve and Trubel were a more likely pairing.
The difference between Eve and the La Femme Nikita character, is that Nikita had needs/desires beyond her missions for the organization. She was more than a soldier, and her feminine side showed through her soldier persona.
Can’t say I’ve ever thought of Adalind as masculine at all. But the show went out of it’s way to downplay the character’s and the actor’s sexuality. Honestly, I never considered Juliette as sexual, or Nick/Juliette as having chemistry, but the show may have wanted it that way and downplayed that aspect also.
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - izzy - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 11:40 AM)Robyn Wrote: but Meisner was shown daydreaming about Adalind during his down time. Why not Eve?
Because he is a male and we are fully capable of tapping the redhead while thinking of the blond at the same time.
And some of you women do the same thing...
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - Robyn - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 05:51 PM)izzy Wrote:It's not about what and why for a male character compared to a female character. It's that Meisner was portrayed as expressing typical needs/desires while Eve was portrayed as experiencing only her duty to an organization's cause. Meisner was no less dedicated to HW's mission, but he didn't live, breathe, and fantasize the mission.(03-05-2017, 11:40 AM)Robyn Wrote: but Meisner was shown daydreaming about Adalind during his down time. Why not Eve?Because he is a male and we are fully capable of tapping the redhead while thinking of the blond at the same time.
And some of you women do the same thing...
RE: Injustice done to the Juliette's character in Grimm - izzy - 03-05-2017
(03-05-2017, 06:14 PM)Robyn Wrote:(03-05-2017, 05:51 PM)izzy Wrote:It's not about what and why for a male character compared to a female character. It's that Meisner was portrayed as expressing typical needs/desires while Eve was portrayed as experiencing only her duty to an organization's cause. Meisner was no less dedicated to HW's mission, but he didn't live, breathe, and fantasize the mission.(03-05-2017, 11:40 AM)Robyn Wrote: but Meisner was shown daydreaming about Adalind during his down time. Why not Eve?Because he is a male and we are fully capable of tapping the redhead while thinking of the blond at the same time.
And some of you women do the same thing...
Awesome post and reputation upped for that : )