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+---- Thread: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? (/Thread-Conrad-Bonaparte-read-Adalind-s-future)
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - irukandji - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 09:23 AM)Robyn Wrote:(01-29-2017, 08:43 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I do think the obsession with the stick, maybe and will drive a wedge between Adalind and Nick , before the ring do
In an interview shortly after the S5 finale, G&K said the ring will cause problems for Nick/Adalind. They may have changed their mind and will have Adalind throw caution to the wind and take the ring off without anything happening to the children because she realizes Bonaparte was simply using fear to keep her inline. Or maybe Rosalee will find a counter spell as lickety-split as she flipped a few pages and knew why the corpse grabbed hold of Juliette.
The first three episodes strongly indicate that Juliette is bubbling to the forefront, so G&K may have decided the conflict will be Nick choosing between the woman is truly loves and his obligation to Kelly & his mother. Of course, the biggest conflict could be Diana as the big bad and Nick determined to destroy her.
Renard would be able to make the decision to destroy Diana rather than allow her to devastate the world. And Renard siding with Nick/Juliette against Adalind would circle the story back to why Diana exists and Team Grimm originally taking Diana from Adalind.
I was making coffee this morning and thinking about Diana. With the great comments on the board as of late, I wondered if everyone is perhaps onto something. I'd like to add some thoughts too.
When Grimm showed the flashback of Kelly taking Diana, Eve was talking about it.
Quote:Do you remember what your mother said to us about Diana? This child has an extraordinary destiny. In the wrong hands, it could do great evil, but in the right hands, it could do great good. So we're talking, like, "changing the course of history" kind of a person.
Diana's power is far greater than anything Renard has.
Then we have Conrad's warning to Adalind:
Quote:Oh, one more thing do not take this ring off, because it will be extremely painful for your children.
Diana has spent all of her life with all kinds of different people; grimms, humans, the royals, wesen, and representatives from HW and BC. What if, by being placed with so many different people, Diana's destiny has already been changed for good? What if placing her with Renard and Adalind was a last ditch effort to sway her back to evil so BC can control the world?
Adalind has been fiddling around with the ring, so it's more than likely she's going to remove it. What if, when she removes it, she turns evil and hooks up with Renard? Could the ring's evil affect Diana and they attempt to use her for evil? If she doesn't cooperate, will they be faced with the fact that they may be forced to destroy her?
Of course in order to do this, Renard and Adalind will have to have some sort of great power. Is that where the stick comes into play? Or does the ring itself give them great power?
What if the extreme pain to the children that Conrad was warning of is the fact that the children will be forced to turn against their mother and in Diana's case, her father?
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - Kathryn Wooten - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:01 AM)irukandji Wrote:I think G&K wants Renard to be redeemed..so turning bad would not fit the spoilers..and besides Miesner is driving him to that redemption now(01-29-2017, 09:23 AM)Robyn Wrote:(01-29-2017, 08:43 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I do think the obsession with the stick, maybe and will drive a wedge between Adalind and Nick , before the ring do
In an interview shortly after the S5 finale, G&K said the ring will cause problems for Nick/Adalind. They may have changed their mind and will have Adalind throw caution to the wind and take the ring off without anything happening to the children because she realizes Bonaparte was simply using fear to keep her inline. Or maybe Rosalee will find a counter spell as lickety-split as she flipped a few pages and knew why the corpse grabbed hold of Juliette.
The first three episodes strongly indicate that Juliette is bubbling to the forefront, so G&K may have decided the conflict will be Nick choosing between the woman is truly loves and his obligation to Kelly & his mother. Of course, the biggest conflict could be Diana as the big bad and Nick determined to destroy her.
Renard would be able to make the decision to destroy Diana rather than allow her to devastate the world. And Renard siding with Nick/Juliette against Adalind would circle the story back to why Diana exists and Team Grimm originally taking Diana from Adalind.
I was making coffee this morning and thinking about Diana. With the great comments on the board as of late, I wondered if everyone is perhaps onto something. I'd like to add some thoughts too.
When Grimm showed the flashback of Kelly taking Diana, Eve was talking about it.
Quote:Do you remember what your mother said to us about Diana? This child has an extraordinary destiny. In the wrong hands, it could do great evil, but in the right hands, it could do great good. So we're talking, like, "changing the course of history" kind of a person.
Diana's power is far greater than anything Renard has.
Then we have Conrad's warning to Adalind:
Quote:Oh, one more thing do not take this ring off, because it will be extremely painful for your children.
Diana has spent all of her life with all kinds of different people; grimms, humans, the royals, wesen, and representatives from HW and BC. What if, by being placed with so many different people, Diana's destiny has already been changed for good? What if placing her with Renard and Adalind was a last ditch effort to sway her back to evil so BC can control the world?
Adalind has been fiddling around with the ring, so it's more than likely she's going to remove it. What if, when she removes it, she turns evil and hooks up with Renard? Could the ring's evil affect Diana and they attempt to use her for evil? If she doesn't cooperate, will they be faced with the fact that they may be forced to destroy her?
Of course in order to do this, Renard and Adalind will have to have some sort of great power. Is that where the stick comes into play? Or does the ring itself give them great power?
What if the extreme pain to the children that Conrad was warning of is the fact that the children will be forced to turn against their mother and in Diana's case, her father?
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - irukandji - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:29 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I think G&K wants Renard to be redeemed..so turning bad would not fit the spoilers..and besides Miesner is driving him to that redemption now
I don't think it's Meisner driving him to redemption. I think it's Conrad haunting him because Renard killed him.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - Kathryn Wooten - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:35 AM)irukandji Wrote:(01-29-2017, 10:29 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I think G&K wants Renard to be redeemed..so turning bad would not fit the spoilers..and besides Miesner is driving him to that redemption now
I don't think it's Meisner driving him to redemption. I think it's Conrad haunting him because Renard killed him.
I think if it was Conrad he be using himself and woged into a zauberbiest ..waking up to see that hovering over your bed ..would be disconsereting...besides Conrad did not care about Miesner, except he was a bug to squash..so I do not think Conrad would haunt Renard by being Miesner.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - irukandji - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:41 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I think if it was Conrad he be using himself and woged into a zauberbiest ..waking up to see that hovering over your bed ..would be disconsereting...besides Conrad did not care about Miesner, except he was a bug to squash..so I do not think Conrad would haunt Renard by being Miesner.
Meisner the ghost wouldn't bring up Bonaparte out of the blue, especially some remark that Bonaparte says hi. Ghosts don't work that way. He wanted to make a point and freak Renard out. That leads me to believe Meisner isn't behind this at all. Bonaparte is.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - jsgrimm45 - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:47 AM)irukandji Wrote:Why if it is Bonaparte would he be telling Sean told you, you pick the wrong side?(01-29-2017, 10:41 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I think if it was Conrad he be using himself and woged into a zauberbiest ..waking up to see that hovering over your bed ..would be disconsereting...besides Conrad did not care about Miesner, except he was a bug to squash..so I do not think Conrad would haunt Renard by being Miesner.
Meisner the ghost wouldn't bring up Bonaparte out of the blue, especially some remark that Bonaparte says hi. Ghosts don't work that way. He wanted to make a point and freak Renard out. That leads me to believe Meisner isn't behind this at all. Bonaparte is.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - irukandji - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:55 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote:(01-29-2017, 10:47 AM)irukandji Wrote:Why if it is Bonaparte would he be telling Sean told you, you pick the wrong side?(01-29-2017, 10:41 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I think if it was Conrad he be using himself and woged into a zauberbiest ..waking up to see that hovering over your bed ..would be disconsereting...besides Conrad did not care about Miesner, except he was a bug to squash..so I do not think Conrad would haunt Renard by being Miesner.
Meisner the ghost wouldn't bring up Bonaparte out of the blue, especially some remark that Bonaparte says hi. Ghosts don't work that way. He wanted to make a point and freak Renard out. That leads me to believe Meisner isn't behind this at all. Bonaparte is.
Didn't Sean kill Bonaparte? Ghosts generally haunt out of revenge.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - jsgrimm45 - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 10:57 AM)irukandji Wrote:Do you watch Supernatural if you did you would see (the series shows more than one type of ghost) that some ghost are a death omens some are death echos. Base on that series Meisner likely is a death echo with a side of warning.(01-29-2017, 10:55 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote:(01-29-2017, 10:47 AM)irukandji Wrote:Why if it is Bonaparte would he be telling Sean told you, you pick the wrong side?(01-29-2017, 10:41 AM)Kathryn Wooten Wrote: I think if it was Conrad he be using himself and woged into a zauberbiest ..waking up to see that hovering over your bed ..would be disconsereting...besides Conrad did not care about Miesner, except he was a bug to squash..so I do not think Conrad would haunt Renard by being Miesner.
Meisner the ghost wouldn't bring up Bonaparte out of the blue, especially some remark that Bonaparte says hi. Ghosts don't work that way. He wanted to make a point and freak Renard out. That leads me to believe Meisner isn't behind this at all. Bonaparte is.
Didn't Sean kill Bonaparte? Ghosts generally haunt out of revenge.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - Robyn - 01-29-2017
Dark and creepy. I like it.
(01-29-2017, 10:01 AM)irukandji Wrote: When Grimm showed the flashback of Kelly taking Diana, Eve was talking about it.This suggests Diana was originally predisposed to evil, and Bonaparte had a way of knowing she had been swayed to the good side, so he manipulated the situation to change her back to evil mode. Do you think Bonaparte was able to manipulate Diana’s thoughts into obsessing over Adalind & Renard as her parents? Perhaps he underestimated Diana’s ability to hurt/kill him because of this obsession.
Quote:Do you remember what your mother said to us about Diana? This child has an extraordinary destiny. In the wrong hands, it could do great evil, but in the right hands, it could do great good. So we're talking, like, "changing the course of history" kind of a person.Then we have Conrad's warning to Adalind:
Diana's power is far greater than anything Renard has.
Quote:Oh, one more thing do not take this ring off, because it will be extremely painful for your children.Diana has spent all of her life with all kinds of different people; grimms, humans, the royals, wesen, and representatives from HW and BC. What if, by being placed with so many different people, Diana's destiny has already been changed for good? What if placing her with Renard and Adalind was a last ditch effort to sway her back to evil so BC can control the world?
Diana has spent all of her life with all kinds of different people; grimms, humans, the royals, wesen, and representatives from HW and BC. What if, by being placed with so many different people, Diana's destiny has already been changed for good? What if placing her with Renard and Adalind was a last ditch effort to sway her back to evil so BC can control the world?
(01-29-2017, 10:01 AM)irukandji Wrote: Adalind has been fiddling around with the ring, so it's more than likely she's going to remove it. What if, when she removes it, she turns evil and hooks up with Renard? Could the ring's evil affect Diana and they attempt to use her for evil? If she doesn't cooperate, will they be faced with the fact that they may be forced to destroy her?Are you thinking Bonaparte’s plan depended on Adalind ignoring his threat and removing the ring? Based on Bonaparte’s vague threat about the ring, I find it confusing that Adalind was able to betray Renard and leave him to be with Nick, especially remove Diana from Renard’s direct supervision, without any consequences. Unless the spell hasn’t kicked in yet, I don’t understand what it was designed to do. I’m wondering if the spell simply hasn’t kicked in yet, and when it does, Adalind’s desires and loyalty will be directed to Renard.
(01-29-2017, 10:01 AM)irukandji Wrote: Of course in order to do this, Renard and Adalind will have to have some sort of great power. Is that where the stick comes into play? Or does the ring itself give them great power?I can understand Bonaparte seeing this as an effective threat to Adalind, but not to the children. Why would he care that the children had to kill evil parents? Wouldn’t he want the children destroyed if they sided with good?
What if the extreme pain to the children that Conrad was warning of is the fact that the children will be forced to turn against their mother and in Diana's case, her father?
The lack of details on Diana’s time with various factions makes it impossible to know whether being taken by these factions had any real effect on her one way or the other. Adding to that confusion is that despite Diana being shown as capable of defending herself since in utero, she has never attempted to prevent any of her kidnappings.
And the argument that she went with Kelly because she knew Kelly was good doesn’t hold water. Diana also went willingly with Kenneth & Juliette, the King, BC, and Meisner if you’re inclined to see him as bad. It seems more likely that Diana’s actions or lack of don’t have anything to do with her mindset, but rather, what the show needs her to do or not do based on the current storyline. And that makes it almost impossible to speculate her next move, or how she'll be portrayed from episode to the next, or how she may or may not be connected to the ring's spell.
RE: Conrad Bonaparte read Adalind's future??? - irukandji - 01-29-2017
(01-29-2017, 11:03 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: Do you watch Supernatural if you did you would see (the series shows more than one type of ghost) that some ghost are a death omens some are death echos. Base on that series Meisner likely is a death echo with a side of warning.
I don't believe that Meisner is a residual haunting or a death echo with warning, or any of that. His ghost is way too communicative and active for that and it just doesn't mesh with what's been communicated about ghosts. BTW, I don't watch Supernatural, but I was a fan of Ghosthunters and Ghostadventures as well as Coast to Coast for years. While they all used different terminology, their findings were often the same with regard to ghosts. Either they were a residual, which mean the same type of haunting over and over or they were the other kind, which was a warning. But even the ones that were warnings were usually a one or two word phrase or some other such nonsense that came across on a tape recording. Oftentimes I couldn't get that it was a warning but the ghosthunters always interpreted it as a warning.
That said, I am skeptical that this is even a ghost that is haunting Renard. I would tend to go with it being more of a magic trick and Bonaparte is behind it.
As always, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.
(01-29-2017, 11:13 AM)Robyn Wrote: And the argument that she went with Kelly because she knew Kelly was good doesn’t hold water. Diana also went willingly with Kenneth & Juliette, the King, BC, and Meisner if you’re inclined to see him as bad.
Your post had so many good things in it, Robyn. I'll start with this first.
My point wasn't that Kelly was good or the king was evil. What I'm saying is the apparent destiny for Diana was to be held by one faction and one faction only. That faction would be the one who would contribute fully to her destiny. That faction would be the one who could use her as a tool for good or for evil.
But that didn't happen. Kelly had possession of her, the royalty had possession of her, HW had her, BC had her. She was exposed to humans, wesen, grimms, covert organizations, both good and bad. I don't know, she might still turn out bad. I'm just making a speculation here.
But what I think happened is that destiny was changed. No one person or organization got her and indoctrinated only their beliefs into her. Instead, she was in the hands of more than a few people who all instilled their beliefs in her. Her destiny may now be in her hands rather than someone else's who could use her for good or for evil. She doesn't seem to be an evil child so far. Maybe she's an instrument for good.