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+--- Thread: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? (/Thread-Big-royal-conspiracy-What-if-Are-Sean-and-Viktor-working-together)
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Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - Adriano Neres Rodrigues - 01-18-2016
Warning to readers
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This is a kind of spin of the thread Sean Renard – understanding his past, foreseeing his future
http://grimmforum.com/forum/Thread-Sean-Renard-%E2%80%93-understanding-his-past-foreseeing-his-future
Which is a generic analysis of the character.
In this new thread I would like to propose a specific theory for debate. I am not necessarily worried about the viability of the theory. I am more interested in the fun of the speculation and in the possibility of closing the possible plot holes.
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In the last four seasons we saw Sean making very interesting allies. He started as a royal. He put Adelaind against Nick transforming them in enemies. He also (probably) out Nick in royals radar creating a new powerful enemy for Nick. Then Sean turned against the apparently old allies (Adelaind and mainly the royals) and used it as an argument to turn Nick his allied (since both had the same enemies). Sean then became allied of the resistance, but not too much allied. I think it is interesting the process: choose a target (Nick, for example), put his own enemies against the target (the royals, in this case) and then use it as argument to become allied of the target. It is a very good manipulation of the target.
I think it is not hard to think that Sean may still have allies inside his family. A person that maybe didn’t agree with the way his treated by his father and his brother. Going very far in the left field, I thought about Viktor. When Sean ordered the killing of Eric, he opened a way for Viktor to the crown. In a certain way, when Viktor exchanged the king’s death with Diana to the resistance, he eliminated a threat to Sean (the king) and to his daughter (no one else in the family will want try to find Diana, at least until Viktor was the king.
Now the big conspiracy idea: what if Viktor and Sean had a deal for one them (Viktor) take the crown of the Renard’s family and use it to try to get the four keys with the royal families while the other (Sean) was responsible for taking the three missing keys? Sean has alliance with a grimm and with the resistance. I think he imagine the missing key will eventually pass by the hands of those two players. Nick has already two. And now They have a connection with the HW that may have a condition to take the other one missing.
In this scenario, Viktor and Sean would have planned that Sean would be the families enemy since the beginning to attract the grimm alliance while Viktor would stay inside the family preparing the uprising and waiting the right moment to kill the king. The uprising would be a threat against the other families… like: We need all the keys together to destroy the uprising. In the end they may be trying to assume not only Renards family, but also the treasure and then have power over all the families. Almost all events would have being planned by them like Juliette transformation, Adelaind taking Nick’s power and then Sean’s mother helping Nick to get it back… and so on.
Here is the question: This plot has many holes, but just for fun… can we close them?
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - jsgrimm45 - 01-18-2016
Interesting plot twist. We have seen Sean Renard can plan. We seen that he has inside the family help so he could have inside help in other royal families. He knows he can't be King but he did say he would return on his own terms.
You make this thread a what if what if you are right. Viktor and Sean working together isn't out of the question. Now that Viktor is King he could call all the dogs off Sean even give Sean a place in the family. Diana is safe Sean is safe if you trust Viktor and for now Viktor wouldn't have anything to lose and a lot to gain.
As long as Diana is Sean's no problems for Viktor or Sean but if LBB is Eric's than Viktor has a problem and Sean is now back to being on the outside.
As for filling holes I'll get back to them just thought your idea may be right on target not a question but a fact.
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - Isa - 01-18-2016
Victor already spilled the beans to Meisner when he was replaced by Kenneth.
If Sean is related to him it'll be a big twist for me... Because we're accompanying Sean's steps since the beginning of the series...
I really don't know what to think about this theory
Lol
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - jsgrimm45 - 01-18-2016
(01-18-2016, 05:21 PM)Isa Wrote: Victor already spilled the beans to Meisner when he was replaced by Kenneth.We know that Viktor is Sean cousin not if he is first second or third just cousins. We all have our friends who we choose and our family who we can't choose. All the royals have their own agenda what works for them, we know they have a long term plan to rule again. So could Sean and cousin Viktor worked together to take out the King? As Sherlock Holmes the game is afoot.
If Sean is related to him it'll be a big twist for me... Because we're accompanying Sean's steps since the beginning of the series...
I really don't know what to think about this theory
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - Isa - 01-18-2016
Hmm I'll pay more attention from now on... Maybe there's something between them, but so far I can't see it.
Although Trubel is hiding things from Nick. I think the whole finale scene where she "kills" Juliette, was planned too. But ok, I'm going off topic here haha~
Viktor will probably show up again, and maybe he'll be ally of someone, since HW is fighting against bad wesen and for the royals it wouldn't be interest for BC to win this war.
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - Adriano Neres Rodrigues - 01-19-2016
Sean and Viktor never said clearly that they were working together... Actually there were signs on the opposite... For example, Viktor ordered Sébastien to be killed. But what if those signs were fake? What if did they create those signs to make the the rest of the family believe they are against each other while there were really conspiring against the family?
Sean's actions like killing Eric ended up helping Viktor while Viktor's actions like killing the king ended up helping Sean... While in surface looks like Sean and Viktor are enemies, a more detailed analysis may show they have common interests...
Are they working together? I don't know. But I think it would be a smart play from both if they are. Sean is smart enough to see it... His alliances show it. Viktor apparently is also very smart. The question is:would they trust each other to make this kind of alliance?
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - aboutnici - 01-19-2016
I still don't trust Sean and Viktor, because they're both shady and always hiding things they know about!
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - Adriano Neres Rodrigues - 01-19-2016
This is an idea for a time line of the conspiracy… I don't think is 100%, but it can be a starting point...
1. Sean was raised with the family. He is well educated and was prepared to be a royal. He dated a girl from another royal family. Probably the king lied to the queen about Sean and she found out he was actually a bastard son she tried to kill him and Elizabeth.
2. Probably until this point Sean had good relations with his relatives, including Viktor.
3. Elizabeth escaped from the queen and took Sean to USA.
4. After the queen’s death, I think the king proposed Sean for him to join the family again, but gave him the quest to take Nick’s family key to prove his loyalty to family.
5. Sean didn’t trust Eric so he looked for Viktor for an alliance against him, if Eric tried something against Sean. No deal yet… just a talk…
6. The king sent a cousin to kill Sean because of the key. Sean killed his cousin. The family knew Sean was against them, but Viktor knew that the king would kill anyone that wasn’t loyal to family. Viktor and Sean start to define their alliance against the king and Eric to protect themselves.
7. The deal: Sean would become allied of Nick and of the resistance. Viktor would make allies inside the families.
8. Sean sent Adelaind against Nick and Hank to make Nick realize he has enemies.
9. First opportunity: Adelaind lost her powers and attacked Juliette. Sean used this to get close to Nick, get the key and give it back to him: first alliance made.
10. Sean had the meeting with the resistance.
11. Adelaind got pregnant to recover her powers.
12. First menace to Sean and Viktor’s plan: Eric got Nick (the zombie Nick plot).
13. The threat becomes opportunity: Sean ordered the death of Eric and Viktor become the next in the line for the crown.
14. Viktor uses his position to talk with other royal families. As I think the royals are behind the BC, I think Viktor started to organize it at this point.
15. Birth of Diana. Kelly brings her and Adelaind to Nick’s place.
16. Viktor came to Portland at king’s order. Out of the screen, Viktor and Sean talk. If the king gets Diana while she was still a baby, he would control her and their plan would fail. Sean and Viktor decided that Kelly was the best way to hide Diana from the king and them they pretended the rescue… Everyone believed Sean and Viktor were working in different directions.
Now I go far in the left field. Grimm writers use too many coincidences in the show (they like Synchronicity). I would like things were more planned. That is why I like to think Juliette transformation was planned.
17. New opportunity. Now thinking a little…
Viktor knew Adelaind had Nick’s blood in her. And because of it this would allow Adelaind to take Nick’s power.
Apparently Adelaind didn’t know that because Viktor had to tell her. Or at least she didn’t remember. She had to read the spell in the book.
Did Viktor know and Didn’t Adelaind? What if…. Someone gave this idea to Viktor?
Looking ahead… Elizabeth said to Rosalee that Adelaind had know idea what she was doing when she used the spell to take Nick’s power… But the way Elizabeth said it, I have the impression Elizabeth knew pretty well the power of the spell…. And didn’t she knew the side effects?
18. Nick lost his powers.
19. Viktor returned to Portland with Adelaind to ‘search’ for Diana. I think that he prepared the way for the BC starts the attacks.
20. Nick recovers his powers and Juliette became hexenet.
21. Viktor returned to Vienna and finished the preparations for the BC. He also prepared the kings death.
22. The king died and Viktor became the new king.
23. The BC starts its attacks.
What happens now?
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - jsgrimm45 - 01-19-2016
If this was a plan it happen with Viktor and Adalind returned to Portland. Up until then Viktor as much as possible for a royal was working for the King, but alway a but when he started to see the handwriting on the wall than he when to Sean or should we think Elizabeth. Viktor said he know where she lived.
Why cut Sean in unless he has to Elizabeth on the other hand she likely wanted the king dead, and had contacts in the resistance from when her and Sean were on the run.
She wanted Diana and Sean did give her to Kelly, so she has a reason to keep Sean out also. That would mean I have to change how I see the character of Elizabeth. If this is the case she not as I had hope a friend to Nick. I never thought she had anything to do with Juliette change I would have to rethink that also. I might even move her up in Black Claw running it for the royals.
Some have posted the didn't trust Elizabeth I did I've been know to be wrong just never thought I could be this wrong. I would have to take may hat off to the writers for faking me out good.
Sean and Viktor had the time in Portland before the King recalled him to come up with a plan B or their own.
Good thread still think you hit the nail on the head with this thread. Viktor may have played a larger role in today's Grimm than I thought.
RE: Big royal conspiracy: What if... Are Sean and Viktor working together? - Adriano Neres Rodrigues - 01-19-2016
(01-19-2016, 02:25 PM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: Some have posted the didn't trust Elizabeth I did I've been know to be wrong just never thought I could be this wrong. I would have to take may hat off to the writers for faking me out good.
One thing I learned from grimm: never trust a hexanbiest…
