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+--- Thread: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? (/Thread-Grimm-Disguised-Social-Commentary)
Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - irukandji - 12-01-2015
Thanks to js for recommending this as a stand alone thread.
Something I've been wondering for a while now is if the writers are making a social commentary in Grimm rather than a moral statement. For instance, the use of guns in Grimm. I can't recall right off hand if I've ever seen a wesen use a gun. On the other hand, it seems Nick uses his just about every week. Could Grimm be advocating gun control in the form of entertainment?
New Guy mentioned there were a couple of instances where wesen used guns. In the five years Grimm has been on the air, this is an extremely low percentage to the law enforcement's use of guns. He also brought up something I had never thought of, Juliette's control of Nick's gun in the spice shop. Thoughts?
RE: Grimm: Social Commentary? - jsgrimm45 - 12-01-2015
Good thread reading your other post I've thinking the what if Grimm as social commentary. I list some of the things I thought of:
1. Juliette a woman villain equal to any male villain. (women equal)
2. Kelly (Grimm) Trubel equal as a Grimm to Nick maybe in some ways better at least Kelly more deadly (women equal)
3. This is one (I don't agree with) but for this thread, I could see this as a social commentary on police the ones who see Nick a bad police officer (all police)
4. If you note all the women in the series have careers and now if Adalind goes back to work as lawyer we will have a working mother
These are just 4 for now as I'm still thinking and looking for other ideas.
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - irukandji - 12-01-2015
For me, one topic that comes immediately to mind is monsters. When I first started watching the series, I thought this was just another series about monsters. Nick inherited special powers to fight these monsters and reduce their threat to Portland. Good versus evil, in other words. But as I watched the series more and more, it became more and more difficult to determine which of the characters were monsters and which were not.
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - Hexenadler - 12-01-2015
(12-01-2015, 04:58 PM)irukandji Wrote: For me, one topic that comes immediately to mind is monsters. When I first started watching the series, I thought this was just another series about monsters. Nick inherited special powers to fight these monsters and reduce their threat to Portland. Good versus evil, in other words. But as I watched the series more and more, it became more and more difficult to determine which of the characters were monsters and which were not.
Depends on whether we're talking about metaphorical monsters, or literal monsters. Sometimes they can be both, particularly with Hexenbiests. But a character like Bud is often more "human" than the actual humans on the show.
Personally speaking, I don't think the writers of "Grimm" are that committed to sneaking clever little subtexts into their stories. Some episodes are better than others, but none of them are up to George Romero-levels of satirical brilliance. If they were, Nick and Juliette's story might have turned out very differently...
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - izzy - 12-01-2015
(12-01-2015, 03:07 PM)irukandji Wrote: Thanks to js for recommending this as a stand alone thread.
Something I've been wondering for a while now is if the writers are making a social commentary in Grimm rather than a moral statement. For instance, the use of guns in Grimm. I can't recall right off hand if I've ever seen a wesen use a gun. On the other hand, it seems Nick uses his just about every week. Could Grimm be advocating gun control in the form of entertainment?
New Guy mentioned there were a couple of instances where wesen used guns. In the five years Grimm has been on the air, this is an extremely low percentage to the law enforcement's use of guns. He also brought up something I had never thought of, Juliette's control of Nick's gun in the spice shop. Thoughts?
Frankly I was amazed that given the age of the characters so portrayed, that there never ever was a discussion of abortion. Moreover, I was flabbergasted when Nick and I believe Rosalee used very pro-life statements about the then unborn Kelly, referencing repeatedly that the child was innocent and Nick stepping between the enraged Juliette and his unborn child and noted the commentary. I was convinced then it was a statement and remain so convinced.
I watched those scenes more than once with my woman and offspring and we all looked at each other and discussed it and were pleasantly surprised.
I also have detected a faint anti-government theme, though more muted that if it exists, I appreciate.
(12-01-2015, 04:58 PM)irukandji Wrote: For me, one topic that comes immediately to mind is monsters. When I first started watching the series, I thought this was just another series about monsters. Nick inherited special powers to fight these monsters and reduce their threat to Portland. Good versus evil, in other words. But as I watched the series more and more, it became more and more difficult to determine which of the characters were monsters and which were not.
Currently in the U.S. the Black lives matter movement is all the rage with *** ********. If you strip out the nonsense and break it down into its logical components, it really boils down to a distrust of Government and an accusation that the law enforcement arm of Government and the judicial branch e is corrupt and covers up its own transgression against its own citizens (my buddy Adriano should find that comment interesting).
So now look at the analogy with Grimm, you have Nick and Co playing judge, jury and executioner, and using the mechanism of Government vested authority to cover up their own transgressions.
Happenstance, a sign of the times, or a social commentary? I think now very possibly a social commentary with the wesen uprising. Is it really wesen lives matter? Is it a modern commentary based on current events?
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - irukandji - 12-01-2015
(12-01-2015, 06:19 PM)izzy Wrote: Frankly I was amazed that given the age of the characters so portrayed, that there never ever was a discussion of abortion. Moreover, I was flabbergasted when Nick and I believe Rosalee used very pro-life statements about the then unborn Kelly, referencing repeatedly that the child was innocent and Nick stepping between the enraged Juliette and his unborn child and noted the commentary. I was convinced then it was a statement and remain so convinced.
I watched those scenes more than once with my woman and offspring and we all looked at each other and discussed it and were pleasantly surprised.
Abortion may not be out of the picture entirely. I don't recall the details, but there was some discussion about the type of child Monroe and Rosalee might have and the dangerous nature of a hybrid child.
Just as a side note with regard to hybrids, I was reading an article about animals tonight. I don't know if anyone had heard of this but back in 2006 (I think), a licensed hunter went up to Alaska to shoot a polar bear. He shot what he believed was a polar bear. He almost got thrown into prison because up close, the bear looked like a white grizzly bear. It was proven the hybrid was part polar bear and so his kill was deemed legal.
I'm not a big believer in the man is causing global warming issue. According to the newest scare tactics, which always blame humans, species are now encroaching on similar species' territories because their territories are shrinking and hybrids are the result. There have only been two of these bears that I have read about. However, hybrids are usually infertile, (i.e. mules). The story behind this hybrid bear is that it was not infertile. The experts are all weirded out over this, but the earth has experienced global warming before and will again. That's just the way it is. I'm not saying man isn't contributing, but so are natural catastrophes like volcanic eruptions.
So what does this have to do with Grimm? I find this really hard to believe, but apparently these wesen species apparently remained pure all of this time. Now we have Monroe and Rosalee encroaching where no wesen has encroached before, marrying and considering children. What will hybrid children do to the purebred wesen existence? Is that natural order slowly being destroyed?
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - brandon - 12-02-2015
are not always esteriles and I would say that nature is more wise.
I read once in a book that some ducks were choosing as couples to ducks of another species - that these were more attractive –being different kind bears if they can have offspring instead the Mule
It seems to me that it is rather a cross designed by the man - which would not happen in nature - as burdego
in what refers to couples in "GRIMM" sure will come out better than the guy in the hour of death - season 2 –
never before last there would be two different species - I am referring to "GRIMM"
is uniensen .no have that cats-now I don't remember how to write it –
the husband of Alice and the seltenvol.
in both it was for interest and power
can happen in real life.
But if the couple is good in the episode "the show must go
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - jsgrimm45 - 12-02-2015
I would add not quite sure what it means the number of episode with children two at least with homeless children.
Every season there has been at least one children episode what can we see in that?
Adalind did talk about not having Eric's/Renard's child if she didn't get her way and become a hexen again, so the writers may have been using that issue showing both sides.
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - Adriano Neres Rodrigues - 12-02-2015
In more generic view, I think there are two important things to be considered in this debate.
The first one is that TV and TV shows are powerful tools to be used for propaganda. I am pretty sure the owners of TV companies and the TV show writers now it and use it.
Considering this, this thread would be not about if there is or there isn’t disguised social Commentary in grimm, but what ideas are being sold in grimm disguised as entertainment.
The second point is the other side of the same coin. Grimm is written to be aired in many countries. I am pretty sure the writers think about it when writing the show. The consequences of this are that the show must be as neutral as possible so it can be aired in other countries.
An example of this point is the gun use by civilian public. I think it is common in USA (at least more common than in Brazil). In Brazil (for example) it is legally forbidden for civilians to use weapons. To fit both cultures, probably the writers choose to limit guns only to the law enforcement most of the time.
This is just one example. I believe this happens considering other countries and other subjects. I don’t think the writers go in deep in the details like: ohhh in Brazil it is forbidden and in Europe it is legal and go on… But I think the writers try to be as neutral as possible so they don’t need to think about those things.
My point is that certainly there is propaganda of some ideas in Grimm, but those must be indirectly and apparently almost neutral so the show can be sold around the world.
RE: Grimm: Disguised Social Commentary? - jsgrimm45 - 12-02-2015
(12-02-2015, 08:33 AM)Adriano Neres Rodrigues Wrote: In more generic view, I think there are two important things to be considered in this debate.Had not thought about the other counties point, opens up other ideas, but as I don't know these points it will have to be forum members like you to point them out. Are there others you see? Could add to @irukandji thread.
The first one is that TV and TV shows are powerful tools to be used for propaganda. I am pretty sure the owners of TV companies and the TV show writers now it and use it.
Considering this, this thread would be not about if there is or there isn’t disguised social Commentary in grimm, but what ideas are being sold in grimm disguised as entertainment.
The second point is the other side of the same coin. Grimm is written to be aired in many countries. I am pretty sure the writers think about it when writing the show. The consequences of this are that the show must be as neutral as possible so it can be aired in other countries.
An example of this point is the gun use by civilian public. I think it is common in USA (at least more common than in Brazil). In Brazil (for example) it is legally forbidden for civilians to use weapons. To fit both cultures, probably the writers choose to limit guns only to the law enforcement most of the time.
This is just one example. I believe this happens considering other countries and other subjects. I don’t think the writers go in deep in the details like: ohhh in Brazil it is forbidden and in Europe it is legal and go on… But I think the writers try to be as neutral as possible so they don’t need to think about those things.
My point is that certainly there is propaganda of some ideas in Grimm, but those must be indirectly and apparently almost neutral so the show can be sold around the world.
