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+--- Thread: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character (/Thread-A-very-interesting-article-that-features-Juliette-s-character)
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - brandon - 12-18-2017
The difference would be:
Adalind would have got angry with Kelly , but would not have killed her.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - Hell Rell - 12-18-2017
(12-18-2017, 03:50 PM)syscrash Wrote:Quote:Antagonists taunting the protagonist instead of outright killing them is very prevalent in all of fiction. That's the reason John McClane survives every Die Hard movie. It just doesn't come to down to physical assaults. Juliette doing what she did was psychological torture. That's why she had Nick point his gun at his best friend while Rosalee watched.It was without a doubt psychological torture. That point people are making that I don't agree with is that she tried to kill Monroe. It's like being made to play Russian roulette with an empty gun. It is still psychologically devastating as long as you think a bullet is in one of the chambers. In Monroe's case it is clear she waited till Monroe was out of the way before pulling the trigger. If there is any doubt, after the shot she released control so Nick could drop the gun. Nick even said he could not let it go before she let him.
Let's make this clear. Are you saying that Juliette wouldn't've had Nick fire the shot if Hank never tackled Monroe or she would've at least pointed the gun elsewhere? Was Rosalee being unreasonable when she said Juliette could've killed Monroe?
From my PoV, it appeared like Juliette was going to have Nick fire that shot whether Hank intervened or not and didn't care if it hit Monroe or not. Saying she always intended for the bullet to miss and knew that Hank would save him and exactly when he would do it and timed her shot that barely missed just right is a pretty big leap.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - New Guy - 12-18-2017
(12-18-2017, 05:15 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:Hi HR,(12-18-2017, 03:50 PM)syscrash Wrote:Quote:Antagonists taunting the protagonist instead of outright killing them is very prevalent in all of fiction. That's the reason John McClane survives every Die Hard movie. It just doesn't come to down to physical assaults. Juliette doing what she did was psychological torture. That's why she had Nick point his gun at his best friend while Rosalee watched.It was without a doubt psychological torture. That point people are making that I don't agree with is that she tried to kill Monroe. It's like being made to play Russian roulette with an empty gun. It is still psychologically devastating as long as you think a bullet is in one of the chambers. In Monroe's case it is clear she waited till Monroe was out of the way before pulling the trigger. If there is any doubt, after the shot she released control so Nick could drop the gun. Nick even said he could not let it go before she let him.
Let's make this clear. Are you saying that Juliette wouldn't've had Nick fire the shot if Hank never tackled Monroe or she would've at least pointed the gun elsewhere? Was Rosalee being unreasonable when she said Juliette could've killed Monroe?
From my PoV, it appeared like Juliette was going to have Nick fire that shot whether Hank intervened or not and didn't care if it hit Monroe or not. Saying she always intended for the bullet to miss and knew that Hank would save him and exactly when he would do it and timed her shot that barely missed just right is a pretty big leap.
Do you suppose she burned Nick's trailer as "psychological torture?" Not all of the books and Grimm effects were burned. What about the gargoyle? Did Hexenette know the bodyguard would push her away from being crushed?
Do you suppose Nick didn't appreciate that Hexenette was magnanimous, not malevolent? Or do you agree that Nick was astute when he gave the order in 4.22:
Quote:Trubel: Nick, if we do find Juliette, what do you want us to do?The titular hero of Grimm cannot be wrong! Kill her!!!
Nick: Kill her.
http://www.tvguide.com/news/grimm-season-5-premiere/
That photo is priceless.
N G
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - irukandji - 12-18-2017
(12-18-2017, 09:50 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: I think expecting Nick to be totally cool and not recoil from seeing Juliette voge right off the bat is completely unfair. Juliette was the one who was shocked to her core and hid her Hexenbiest from Nick so she should've understood his reaction and gave him time to adjust the same as she needed.
She didn't recoil from him when he was the murderous zombie and he didn't even know her. She stood by him when he made an idiot of himself with the muse.
This wasn't some strange hexenbiest coming to attack him, it was supposedly the love of his life. Aside from that, Nick was a seasoned cop, years into the force. For him to recoil from Juliette makes Nick look like a wuss.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - Hell Rell - 12-18-2017
(12-18-2017, 06:14 PM)irukandji Wrote:(12-18-2017, 09:50 AM)Hell Rell Wrote: I think expecting Nick to be totally cool and not recoil from seeing Juliette voge right off the bat is completely unfair. Juliette was the one who was shocked to her core and hid her Hexenbiest from Nick so she should've understood his reaction and gave him time to adjust the same as she needed.
She didn't recoil from him when he was the murderous zombie and he didn't even know her. She stood by him when he made an idiot of himself with the muse.
This wasn't some strange hexenbiest coming to attack him, it was supposedly the love of his life. Aside from that, Nick was a seasoned cop, years into the force. For him to recoil from Juliette seems a bit on the wussy side.
There's a difference between those instances, also including when Nick didn't recoil from Adalind as mentioned by someone else, and Nick taking a step back from Juliette. Juliette was aware he became a zombie and he was under the spell of the Musai before being confronted with it as Nick knew Adalind got her Hexenbiest back before seeing Adalind woge again. Nick had no idea that Juliette became a Hexenbiest so it would make no sense for him not to have a strong reaction to it because he had no forewarning to brace himself.
Besides, Juliette had a different introduction to wesen. Remember how Rosalee eased her into the whole thing. She made sure to explain what she was before woging and stopped Monroe from woging first because she knew that he shouldn't be her introduction to wesen. Juliette still ran out of the store and needed a moment to gather herself before coming back in. Nick didn't get the luxury of knowing what happened to Juliette beforehand. Even Renard took a step back when Juliette woged at his front door.
I don't see how Nick recoiling when seeing Juliette woge for the first time is wussy. Seasoned cops like Hank and Wu nearly drove themselves crazy when seeing someone woged for the first time. It's also worth mentioning that Nick thought she was Adalind at first and therefore not his beloved Juliette.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - brandon - 12-18-2017
It is very lógical that Nick think that, besides once Juliette was kidnapped by Ariel who received it in bed !.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - syscrash - 12-18-2017
Quote:Let's make this clear. Are you saying that Juliette wouldn't've had Nick fire the shot if Hank never tackled Monroe or she would've at least pointed the gun elsewhere? Was Rosalee being unreasonable when she said Juliette could've killed Monroe?The question can be answered with a simple comparison. If Juliette tried to kill Monroe. That would mean Adalind tried to kill Juliette with the cat scratch, and also tried to kill Hank. Lets compare the difference. Juliette was in control when Nick pulled the trigger. Adalind had now idea if they would find a cure for Juliette and again find a cure for Hank. a side note Adalind never apologized to Hank. Plus Hank was an innocent bystander. At least with Juliette they where all involved with what was driving her anger.
From my PoV, it appeared like Juliette was going to have Nick fire that shot whether Hank intervened or not and didn't care if it hit Monroe or not. Saying she always intended for the bullet to miss and knew that Hank would save him and exactly when he would do it and timed her shot that barely missed just right is a pretty big leap.
Quote:Do you suppose she burned Nick's trailer as "psychological torture?" Not all of the books and Grimm effects were burned. What about the gargoyle? Did Hexenette know the bodyguard would push her away from being crushed?That make no sense. especially since I have already stated the trailer was the result of a women scorned. There was nothing psychological about it. The same with the statue. Like the trailer that was pure revenge.
Do you suppose Nick didn't appreciate that Hexenette was magnanimous, not malevolent? Or do you agree that Nick was astute when he gave the order in 4.22:
I will give you the first woge would have taken him by surprise. But he still walked out the house without saying a thing. The second time what was his excuse. He recoiled before she tried to kiss him. She even said you can't even look at me. Even when she came down stairs after Nick sleep on the couch he could not look at her even though she was not woged. Then again when she was in jail he recoiled when she woged and touched his hand.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - Hell Rell - 12-18-2017
It's reasonable to say that Adalind tried to kill Hank. She would've preferred for Nick to hand over the key over Hank dying but she didn't care about him being collateral damage.
I think it's even more reasonable to say that Adalind tried to kill Juliette because I don't think she expected Renard to wake her. She knew what the result of him doing so would be but she wasn't banking on it. I don't dispute that Adalind was despicable back then and I don't even blame Juliette for trying to drop that gargoyle on her head since it happened before she found out she was pregnant.
With that in mind, I think Juliette didn't care any more about killing Monroe than Adalind did about killing Hank. They were both pretty much indifferent about what would happen to Nick's buddies.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - irukandji - 12-18-2017
(12-18-2017, 06:35 PM)Hell Rell Wrote: There's a difference between those instances, also including when Nick didn't recoil from Adalind as mentioned by someone else, and Nick taking a step back from Juliette. Juliette was aware he became a zombie and he was under the spell of the Musai before being confronted with it as Nick knew Adalind got her Hexenbiest back before seeing Adalind woge again. Nick had no idea that Juliette became a Hexenbiest so it would make no sense for him not to have a strong reaction to it because he had no forewarning to brace himself.
Besides, Juliette had a different introduction to wesen. Remember how Rosalee eased her into the whole thing. She made sure to explain what she was before woging and stopped Monroe from woging first because she knew that he shouldn't be her introduction to wesen. Juliette still ran out of the store and needed a moment to gather herself before coming back in. Nick didn't get the luxury of knowing what happened to Juliette beforehand. Even Renard took a step back when Juliette woged at his front door.
I don't see how Nick recoiling when seeing Juliette woge for the first time is wussy. Seasoned cops like Hank and Wu nearly drove themselves crazy when seeing someone woged for the first time. It's also worth mentioning that Nick thought she was Adalind at first and therefore not his beloved Juliette.
I don't get where the thought that Juliette was aware suddenly makes her okay to deal with Nick the zombie. I'm not pumped on DG's acting skills, but I have to admit, he made one scary and insane zombie who was insane and mean. Knowing he's a zombie doesn't mean Juliette knew exactly what she was going to encounter, but she was there for Nick. She was there for him to help him through withdrawal after the muse got to him.
I don't cut Nick a break for recoiling from Juliette. He's a trained cop. It should have been instinct for him to remain impassive to her. It also should have been instinct for him to immediately stand by her side rather than leaving her alone to wonder where he was going.
RE: A very interesting article that features Juliette's character - Hell Rell - 12-18-2017
(12-18-2017, 09:56 PM)irukandji Wrote: I don't get where the thought that Juliette was aware suddenly makes her okay to deal with Nick the zombie. I'm not pumped on DG's acting skills, but I have to admit, he made one scary and insane zombie who was insane and mean. Knowing he's a zombie doesn't mean Juliette knew exactly what she was going to encounter, but she was there for Nick. She was there for him to help him through withdrawal after the muse got to him.
I don't cut Nick a break for recoiling from Juliette. He's a trained cop. It should have been instinct for him to remain impassive to her. It also should have been instinct for him to immediately stand by her side rather than leaving her alone to wonder where he was going.
Juliette wasn't alone when she encountered Nick both of those times. She had the crew with her and they were there to cure Nick. They all knew it would be over in a matter of minutes. It's still a scary thing but that has to be considered.
Nick is a trained cop so that means all of his natural reflexes should be turned off at something he completely didn't expect and happened at his home instead of on the job?
And what about Renard? He's also a trained cop and has been one longer than Nick. Renard is also a Zauberbiest and has been acquainted with the wesen world and Hexenbiests a whole lot longer than Nick has. Yet, he was startled when he first saw Juliette woge and needed time to regain his composure.
Nick not being cut a break when he recoiled from Juliette is asking him to be more like Eve. I guess someone should've just beat him into submission until he wasn't shocked by anything that ever happens.