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+--- Thread: Diana (/Thread-Diana)
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RE: Diana - irukandji - 12-20-2015
(12-19-2015, 10:20 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: That is a good question I've wondered about something Viktor in the car and the King the blocks was another question and then the warning to the King. While in the womb do you think she heard and took in thing in the castle and doesn't like the royals?
I remember something about the car bur not much. What happened between Diana and Victor in the car?
RE: Diana - jsgrimm45 - 12-20-2015
(12-20-2015, 08:17 AM)irukandji Wrote:He wanted to look at the locket and she closed it than made a skull out of the coffee. I took it as a warning to him.(12-19-2015, 10:20 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: That is a good question I've wondered about something Viktor in the car and the King the blocks was another question and then the warning to the King. While in the womb do you think she heard and took in thing in the castle and doesn't like the royals?
I remember something about the car bur not much. What happened between Diana and Victor in the car?
RE: Diana - speakeasy - 12-20-2015
I think Kelly was a good mother. When her husband and Kelly's friend were killed by the four Schakals looking for the coins of Zakynthos Kelly was guarding (Kimura was one of the sent assassins) they were burned beyond recognition and the Schakals took the woman's head, thinking it was Kelly. Nick was 12 yrs. old and Kelly placed him in Marie's care to safeguard him. (Kelly went underground to hide her existence from her enemies, first starting to trail the Schakals who killed her husband and dear friend. Then she found out the seriousness of the plan the seven Royal families had to globally replace democratic governments with autocratic rule, and then started working with the Laufer or Resistance, to defeat them.) She told Nick it was done only to keep him from being killed. The same thing happened to Adalind, her baby had to sent to a safe place to raise. It may be a choice facing Nick, too.
Something almost spiritual happened between Kelly and Diana on the plane from Zurich, and imo, they took to each other instantaneously. Of course, there were the incidents with the locket. Another example of Diana's attachment to Kelly was that time when Diana made Monroe and Rosalee's clocks' hands spin around and around with her inconsolable crying until Kelly walked thru the door and she immediately calmed down. Kelly was the one who noticed how gifted the baby was and had the sort of 'revelation' that this special one would possess the power of either great good or great evil - depending on how she was raised. And the rest of the group, including her father, Renard, seemed to know she was right. She only had the child for a short time, but I hope her influence was sufficient to point Diana in the right direction. Maybe she had her the equivalent of 3-4 years considering how fast she's aging.
Speaking of Kelly, I've always thought that Juliette set fire to the trailer as a ruse to make certain Nick was occupied while she secretly went to the house to email Kelly. Think Nick noticed the mouse had been moved when he came home, but didn't make anything of it.
This a little out there, but I remembered when rewatching the season one episode that Kelly had two very noticable scars on her cheek and forehead. Didn't see them on the head in the box; if I didn't know Mary M. wouldn't come back to the show, I'd wonder about that. Maybe they were there and just didn't show up on the screen.
RE: Diana - jsgrimm45 - 12-20-2015
(12-20-2015, 03:38 PM)speakeasy Wrote: I think Kelly was a good mother. When her husband and Kelly's friend were killed by the four Schakals looking for the coins of Zakynthos Kelly was guarding (Kimura was one of the sent assassins) they were burned beyond recognition and the Schakals took the woman's head, thinking it was Kelly. Nick was 12 yrs. old and Kelly placed him in Marie's care to safeguard him. (Kelly went underground to hide her existence from her enemies, first starting to trail the Schakals who killed her husband and dear friend. Then she found out the seriousness of the plan the seven Royal families had to globally replace democratic governments with autocratic rule, and then started working with the Laufer or Resistance, to defeat them.) She told Nick it was done only to keep him from being killed. The same thing happened to Adalind, her baby had to sent to a safe place to raise. It may be a choice facing Nick, too.Interesting thought on the trailer fire. That did make sure Nick wasn't likely to return home. On the scars I couldn't tell myself maybe someone did.
Something almost spiritual happened between Kelly and Diana on the plane from Zurich, and imo, they took to each other instantaneously. Of course, there were the incidents with the locket. Another example of Diana's attachment to Kelly was that time when Diana made Monroe and Rosalee's clocks' hands spin around and around with her inconsolable crying until Kelly walked thru the door and she immediately calmed down. Kelly was the one who noticed how gifted the baby was and had the sort of 'revelation' that this special one would possess the power of either great good or great evil - depending on how she was raised. And the rest of the group, including her father, Renard, seemed to know she was right. She only had the child for a short time, but I hope her influence was sufficient to point Diana in the right direction. Maybe she had her the equivalent of 3-4 years considering how fast she's aging.
Speaking of Kelly, I've always thought that Juliette set fire to the trailer as a ruse to make certain Nick was occupied while she secretly went to the house to email Kelly. Think Nick noticed the mouse had been moved when he came home, but didn't make anything of it.
This a little out there, but I remembered when rewatching the season one episode that Kelly had two very noticable scars on her cheek and forehead. Didn't see them on the head in the box; if I didn't know Mary M. wouldn't come back to the show, I'd wonder about that. Maybe they were there and just didn't show up on the screen.
Diana because of the connection with Kelly I think the writers will make her (what we see of her) on the side of right. Some post have said she is a adult in a child's body they could be right I also think she knows and even more understands everything going on around her. I watch a some show where there are people who can remember every minute of their life just give a date and they tell everything about what they did on that date. I think Diana is like that as the writers so far have shown us.
RE: Diana - speakeasy - 12-20-2015
(12-20-2015, 03:49 PM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: Diana because of the connection with Kelly I think the writers will make her (what we see of her) on the side of right. Some post have said she is a adult in a child's body they could be right I also think she knows and even more understands everything going on around her. I watch a some show where there are people who can remember every minute of their life just give a date and they tell everything about what they did on that date. I think Diana is like that as the writers so far have shown us.
Total recall, good idea. Adult in a child's body is a good way to think about her. Another impressive gift to add to Diana's list. But she certainly is an enigma. Her willingness to use violence to protect is a little daunting. She had the imperious attitude of royalty in choosing to get rid of one who she deemed 'unworthy', threatening, or somehow in the way - as demonstrated by her enthusiasm at Meisner's tossing the King out of the helicopter. I found that troubling unless her accelerated maturation stops short at a child's delight in naughtiness.
On the other hand, if she is fortunate enough to get someone who loves and guides her along for the next few years, maybe the good start I hope she received from Kelly will keep her on the right path.
RE: Diana - New Guy - 12-20-2015
Hi Speakeasy,
Your theory:
Quote:Speaking of Kelly, I've always thought that Juliette set fire to the trailer as a ruse to make certain Nick was occupied while she secretly went to the house to email Kelly. Think Nick noticed the mouse had been moved when he came home, but didn't make anything of it.Is plausible. Hexenette's tirades of murder and mayhem make me so angry that I miss some of the nuances of her violence.
Speaking of the trailer, I read as much or more Grimm Fan Commentary about Hexenette's arson crime than all her murder crimes. It is kind of sad we place more value on possessions than people.
New Guy
RE: Diana - irukandji - 12-20-2015
(12-20-2015, 05:01 PM)speakeasy Wrote: On the other hand, if she is fortunate enough to get someone who loves and guides her along for the next few years, maybe the good start I hope she received from Kelly will keep her on the right path.
Hey speakeasy, I wanted to ask a question. You mentioned in the Juliette and the Mayor thread that the only alternative you saw for Juliette after this uprising was over was for her to be killed off because the character was just to powerful to be left alive. I am paraphrasing here, so apologies. I am assuming you think she should be killed whether she ends up being a force for good or for evil.
Diana, in my opinion, is more powerful than Juliette ever was. What is your opinion on what should happen to her after the uprising?
This was a quote from js in the how powerful is Diana thread:
Quote:Understand spoken words and meaning Adalind what are you going to Nick kill me and my baby shakes house bend spoon she had to understand kill and used the telekinesis again.
First a comment here. I thought it interesting that Juliette used the same technique at the spice shop (shaking the house). Apparently this must be some kind of a threat mechanism for hexenbiests like Diana and Juliette?
We know Diana can defend herself and Adalind. So I'm wondering why she didn't save Kelly.
There's also something else I've been wondering about, and that's why she hasn't made an attempt to contact Adalind.
RE: Diana - speakeasy - 12-20-2015
(12-20-2015, 05:39 PM)irukandji Wrote:(12-20-2015, 05:01 PM)speakeasy Wrote: On the other hand, if she is fortunate enough to get someone who loves and guides her along for the next few years, maybe the good start I hope she received from Kelly will keep her on the right path.
Hey speakeasy, I wanted to ask a question. You mentioned in the Juliette and the Mayor thread that the only alternative you saw for Juliette after this uprising was over was for her to be killed off because the character was just to powerful to be left alive. I am paraphrasing here, so apologies. I am assuming you think she should be killed whether she ends up being a force for good or for evil.
Diana, in my opinion, is more powerful than Juliette ever was. What is your opinion on what should happen to her after the uprising?
Hi, Irukandji, I agree that Diana is much more powerful than Juliette. She's a blank slate now, with the story of how she uses her gifts to be written by those who guide her from here on, imo. Can't envision her going bad, because I've always thought she was the one who would save the world, but her behavior is kinda puzzling right now. So, after the uprising, good or bad, I'll still hold to the prospect of her being a righteous girl - and I see no reason now to think she couldn't live in society without being a threat to the general welfare.
Think the word I used to explain why I thought Juliette would have to be killed off was dangerous. Closest I can come to describing it is that she's been 'rearranged' more than once, others have acted upon her, it's not her fault, imo. If I understand correctly, she now has no emotions. If I have that wrong (I don't read the spoilers, but I've read a couple of interviews), I'll have to retract. But without emotions, I don't think there could be a force for good or for evil; just a force. Without emotions I don't feel we can have a conscience; those who cannot experience the emotion of empathy cannot feel it, therefore it doesn't exist in their internal universe, thus they have no conscience. Those who show they have no conscience can't exist peaceably with others, they are a danger to society.
If she does have some emotions, just not any associated with her relationship to Nick, then I still feel the same. But that is a visceral inclination and harder to put into words, the character just seems bound for tragedy.
There's good news here, I rarely call 'em right, and I'm probably really wrong about this. To the chagrin of some posters, I'm a big fan of Juliette.
(12-20-2015, 05:15 PM)New Guy Wrote: Hi Speakeasy,
Your theory:Quote:Speaking of Kelly, I've always thought that Juliette set fire to the trailer as a ruse to make certain Nick was occupied while she secretly went to the house to email Kelly. Think Nick noticed the mouse had been moved when he came home, but didn't make anything of it.Is plausible. Hexenette's tirades of murder and mayhem make me so angry that I miss some of the nuances of her violence.
Speaking of the trailer, I read as much or more Grimm Fan Commentary about Hexenette's arson crime than all her murder crimes. It is kind of sad we place more value on possessions than people.
New Guy
I agree with you closing statement, but it seems that most posters object strongly to immoral behavior on the part of all the characters on Grimm and that's a good thing. You have a family to have to constantly explain what they see happening on the program in light of decent behavior so it's probably discouraging to see the trend toward more darkness on Grimm. Until I started reading more in depth the postings about what makes Grimm folks tick, I just watched for the pure entertainment value of the show. But have to admit, there would be much more of a responsibility to filter through my t.v. viewing if I had youngsters to answer to.
RE: Diana - speakeasy - 12-20-2015
Hey again, Irukandji, just noticed your comments about why Diana doesn't contact Adalind and why she didn't save Kelly. There's nothing I can come up with to explain why the child didn't save Kelly. It flies in the face of what we know about her abilities. I think you've suggested that perhaps Diana didn't want to save Kelly for some reason. It's possible. What a crappy thought, but nothing else seems to fit. Suppose it's possible that Kelly isn't dead, but that would be too fantastical. Or it may be that Diana simply didn't have an awareness of what was happening because Kelly may have assured her everything was fine before entering Nick's house.
Maybe it's just a plot device that was used for convenience to suit the direction the writers wanted to take the story.
Why she doesn't contact her mother is easier for me accept; she is, after all, still a child who hasn't begun to reach her ultimate level of power. So maybe she just isn't able to control and shape events that are not within her immediate range.
The house shaking thing is scary. I agree it must go with the territory of being a Hexenbiest; I remember Adalind doing something like it outside the PPB when she found out they had taken Diana away. And just think, Diana will probably be able to bring down a building in about a week from Tuesday.
RE: Diana - jsgrimm45 - 12-21-2015
Please read all the posts above this one as they all have good points. I made this a new reply to give and get new ideas..
What do we know about Diana for sure? She likely killed the verrat who hit Adalind in the stomach with the pen but the is a small chance the Adalind did it. I would add total recall even inside the womb. She understands her needs. She has learn to use her power very well even as a baby. She understands threat even if just spoken. In the plane I believe she knew Kelly was more protection than Adalind. Others may see some things I missed.
What has she done that we seen she took hold of Meisner hand where he touched Adalind but didn't do anything other than warning. Adalind killed the verrat at the car as they got a way Diana didn't. At the house when she heard kill she again only warned them. At Monroe's house she was afraid without Kelly so she was cause some problems but didn't hurt anyone. I start to see a pattern warning not injurys.
I think the writers didn't plan on getting Kelly out of the series so when she refused to do any more (I dislike that if you take a job you should finish it) they came up with a way and the goofed up plain and simple. Might have work if Diana was still a baby or if Kelly left her in the car and was killed. Diana could have been shown sleeping in the car. But they didn't so and the fans caught their mistake and now we have things to debated on why Diana didn't help. For good reason.
If I were the writes I clear this up maybe (others please post what you think would work). Meisner gets word on Viktor deal with the resistance but he owes Kelly so he sent an email warning her that the King and Kenneth were in Portland to get Diana.
He may not have known Juliette would be the one to set her up for the kill. Kelly could have taken this to mean that Juliette email was on the up and up because of Meisner email.
She bring Diana with her because she thinks Juliette will take care of Diana while she helps Nick with Kenneth and the King. She has been teaching Diana not to show her powers even to help her, so Diana does what Kelly told her to do. Now we are at the helicopter Diana knows it is Meisner and knows the King is going to get pay back so she shows him that he is dead.
The problem I have with the Diana thing is the resistance setup Kelly now maybe they thought she could fight her way out, but still if I were Diana and Nick the resistance would be on the to do list, and if Meisner had any knowledge of this he'd have problems also, but because Diana didn't do anything I think the resistance kept him in the dark also as to who had Diana so he may be none to happy either.