(06-08-2015, 07:19 AM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]Absolutely agree with you irukandji, most of the spells/potions in Grimm have been done well enough, except for this one, it really did feel like the writers did rush through the last few episodes were rushed a bit. They weren't terrible but could have been done a bit better, in fact, I get the feeling that it may have been more of a plan to kill Juliette off in Season 5, but circumstances on both sides, Bitsie and the writers may have forced them to move that storyline along a bit faster than intended. Just a guess. I just think her character was designed to be weak, not without some good points but she was never truly a big part of the gang, there really wasn't much she could do to help them.
I did read that Bitsie had 3 movies she's doing this year and that seems to be the excuse for Bitsie leaving, however, I'm thinking she might have gotten tired of playing Juliette, except the Hexxenbeist Juliette, which even she has said was fun and her idea, but since I believe Juliette was created as a doomed character, ultimately to be killed in order to make Nick's character become even darker and the show overall, as well, Bitsie and the writers may have both decided to kill off Juliette in Season 4 rather than wait one more season. Again, just a theory/guess.
By the way, did you guys know that Bitsie and David are dating? Yup, Nick and Juliette are a couple in real life. lol
Did you believe that Juliette was a doomed character from the start?
(06-08-2015, 11:01 AM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2015, 07:19 AM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]Absolutely agree with you irukandji, most of the spells/potions in Grimm have been done well enough, except for this one, it really did feel like the writers did rush through the last few episodes were rushed a bit. They weren't terrible but could have been done a bit better, in fact, I get the feeling that it may have been more of a plan to kill Juliette off in Season 5, but circumstances on both sides, Bitsie and the writers may have forced them to move that storyline along a bit faster than intended. Just a guess. I just think her character was designed to be weak, not without some good points but she was never truly a big part of the gang, there really wasn't much she could do to help them.
I did read that Bitsie had 3 movies she's doing this year and that seems to be the excuse for Bitsie leaving, however, I'm thinking she might have gotten tired of playing Juliette, except the Hexxenbeist Juliette, which even she has said was fun and her idea, but since I believe Juliette was created as a doomed character, ultimately to be killed in order to make Nick's character become even darker and the show overall, as well, Bitsie and the writers may have both decided to kill off Juliette in Season 4 rather than wait one more season. Again, just a theory/guess.
By the way, did you guys know that Bitsie and David are dating? Yup, Nick and Juliette are a couple in real life. lol
Did you believe that Juliette was a doomed character from the start?
I agree with wessenrein Juliette was going be used as a way for Nick to go after the royal.
In one of your other posts about liking the why (paraphrase) behind potions try this for Juliette. It was a four step accident step one in a coma potion step two the potion to wake her up step three the potion to get her memories back and last step was changing in to Adalind and sleeping with a Grimm. These four steps created the hexenbeist it wasn't the last potion by itself it was the total of the four a plain old accident that no one could have seen coming.
(06-08-2015, 12:43 PM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]In one of your other posts about liking the why (paraphrase) behind potions try this for Juliette. It was a four step accident step one in a coma potion step two the potion to wake her up step three the potion to get her memories back and last step was changing in to Adalind and sleeping with a Grimm. These four steps created the hexenbeist it wasn't the last potion by itself it was the total of the four a plain old accident that no one could have seen coming.
Was this something you found, jsgrimm?
(06-08-2015, 01:40 PM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2015, 12:43 PM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]In one of your other posts about liking the why (paraphrase) behind potions try this for Juliette. It was a four step accident step one in a coma potion step two the potion to wake her up step three the potion to get her memories back and last step was changing in to Adalind and sleeping with a Grimm. These four steps created the hexenbeist it wasn't the last potion by itself it was the total of the four a plain old accident that no one could have seen coming.
Was this something you found, jsgrimm?
No just thinking how this could have happen and no one could have explained it.
(06-08-2015, 01:44 PM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2015, 01:40 PM)irukandji Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2015, 12:43 PM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: [ -> ]In one of your other posts about liking the why (paraphrase) behind potions try this for Juliette. It was a four step accident step one in a coma potion step two the potion to wake her up step three the potion to get her memories back and last step was changing in to Adalind and sleeping with a Grimm. These four steps created the hexenbeist it wasn't the last potion by itself it was the total of the four a plain old accident that no one could have seen coming.
Was this something you found, jsgrimm?
No just thinking how this could have happen and no one could have explained it.
Well, no one tried to explain it, and that also bothers me about this whole issue with Juliette becoming the hexenbiest. I still think the hexenbiest was not a spell, but something in Juliette's blood and when she slept with Nick while in Adelind's form, that triggered the hexenbiest within her.
irukandji, I agree with you that is was a poor way to execute the spell and storyline of Juliette becoming a hexenbeist, they could have put a little bit of explanation, at the very least, Adalind should have gotten her powers back before using that spell, then it would at least have made sense.
Then you could say that Julette's hexenbeist was truly a side effect of the spell, which I'm sure that's what the writers were going for, it was just poorly written/executed, at least that one flaw was overlooked.
Now, to your question, Do I think Juliette was a doomed character from the start....Yes. It's not like Bitsie Tulloch is that bad of an actress, she played the part well, for what she had to work with. The Julette character was sort of bland, a good gf for Nick but not much more, until the hexenbeist, which spiced it up for a short while and gave them a way to kill off Julette. I had that feeling from the moment Aunt Marie warned Nick to end it with Juliette, also, I believe that it may have been a quick change of plans to kill her off in season 4. The last few episodes did feel a bit rushed in the storyline, especially the final show. I'm just guessing, but thinking that the writers may have originally wanted to kill her off in season 5, just to carry her new character a bit further, if that's true, then they may have rushed Kelly's execution as well, though I'm positive both was going to happen no matter what.
(06-09-2015, 07:57 AM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]irukandji, I agree with you that is was a poor way to execute the spell and storyline of Juliette becoming a hexenbeist, they could have put a little bit of explanation, at the very least, Adalind should have gotten her powers back before using that spell, then it would at least have made sense.
Then you could say that Julette's hexenbeist was truly a side effect of the spell, which I'm sure that's what the writers were going for, it was just poorly written/executed, at least that one flaw was overlooked.
Now, to your question, Do I think Juliette was a doomed character from the start....Yes. It's not like Bitsie Tulloch is that bad of an actress, she played the part well, for what she had to work with. The Julette character was sort of bland, a good gf for Nick but not much more, until the hexenbeist, which spiced it up for a short while and gave them a way to kill off Julette. I had that feeling from the moment Aunt Marie warned Nick to end it with Juliette, also, I believe that it may have been a quick change of plans to kill her off in season 4. The last few episodes did feel a bit rushed in the storyline, especially the final show. I'm just guessing, but thinking that the writers may have originally wanted to kill her off in season 5, just to carry her new character a bit further, if that's true, then they may have rushed Kelly's execution as well, though I'm positive both was going to happen no matter what.
Alalind did have her powers back. Victor told she could come to Vienna if she took Nick's powers so she could be with Diana. She had to use hexenbeist blood to open the book.
That is why in one of my posts on the subject stealing from (CSI) it was the hair they used to make Juliette Adalind. The hair contained the potion she use to get her powers back so it was like Juliette did the same ritual Adalind had used.
(06-09-2015, 07:57 AM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]irukandji, I agree with you that is was a poor way to execute the spell and storyline of Juliette becoming a hexenbeist, they could have put a little bit of explanation, at the very least, Adalind should have gotten her powers back before using that spell, then it would at least have made sense.
Then you could say that Julette's hexenbeist was truly a side effect of the spell, which I'm sure that's what the writers were going for, it was just poorly written/executed, at least that one flaw was overlooked.
I checked the Grimm wiki last night for a synopsis of the episode and it says the hexenbiest was a side effect of the potion. At first I disagreed with this as wikis are known to be incorrect from time to time. But after thinking about it, I actually can see it being a side effect of the potion. I use the term, 'side effect', loosely though, because I don't believe Juliette acquired parts of the permanent hexenbiest from the previous spell she was under, or that she somehow picked up a part of Adalind's hexenbiest. I believe that when Juliette slept with Nick, something in him triggered the hexenbiest within her. I think Henrietta was testing for a potion when she tested Juliette's blood. Instead of finding a potion she found a hexenbiest she'd never encountered before and that's why she told Juliette her condition was permanent. Too bad Henrietta was killed off so quickly. I think she would have been a great help to Juliette.
(06-09-2015, 07:57 AM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]Now, to your question, Do I think Juliette was a doomed character from the start....Yes. It's not like Bitsie Tulloch is that bad of an actress, she played the part well, for what she had to work with. The Julette character was sort of bland, a good gf for Nick but not much more, until the hexenbeist, which spiced it up for a short while and gave them a way to kill off Julette. I had that feeling from the moment Aunt Marie warned Nick to end it with Juliette, also, I believe that it may have been a quick change of plans to kill her off in season 4. The last few episodes did feel a bit rushed in the storyline, especially the final show. I'm just guessing, but thinking that the writers may have originally wanted to kill her off in season 5, just to carry her new character a bit further, if that's true, then they may have rushed Kelly's execution as well, though I'm positive both was going to happen no matter what.
I recall when Aunt Marie warned Nick, but I never believed it. For one thing, Aunt Marie's warning was extremely generic. It could have gone a hundred different ways or it could have gone nowhere. The very least she could have done was explain to Nick what she meant. For another, Nick himself doesn't seem to believe her. He never brings it up to Juliette, or even talks about it with Monroe or Hank. So if he doesn't believe there's going to be some foreshadowing down the road, I don't know how the audience can. Then there's Kelly herself. She never confirms Aunt Marie's warning or issues one of her own.
I was thinking about Adalind today and wanted to ask you something. Do you think the potion she made was actually poison and would have killed Juliette?
I believe Aunt Marie's warning was sincere, I think, from her perspective, she had seen bad things happen to Grimms with families and that is one reason why she warned Nick, the other could be that she knew Nick would be in far greater danger because of the key she gave him. I think Kelly didn't warn Nick about relationships because she felt remorse and guilt over leaving Nicky and being gone for so long and him thinking she was dead. Nick doesn't want to believe Juliette is in mortal danger because he loves her, his heart getting in the way of his head.
If you mean the spell Adalind used to turn into Julette? No, I don't think so, I believe even Adalind was shocked that Julette had turned into a Hexxenbeist. I believe that spell was simply to get Nick out of the way by taking his powers, also a bit of retaliation by Adalind since Nick had taken her powers. Also, I do recall Adalind muttering something like; "Since you took something from me, I'm going to take something from you." to that effect and I think it definitely meant Nick's Grimm but it also could have meant Julette, not by killing her but once they realized it was Adalind Nick slept with, Juliette would likely leave Nick even though it wasn't truly his fault.
(06-09-2015, 05:09 PM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]I believe Aunt Marie's warning was sincere, I think, from her perspective, she had seen bad things happen to Grimms with families and that is one reason why she warned Nick, the other could be that she knew Nick would be in far greater danger because of the key she gave him. I think Kelly didn't warn Nick about relationships because she felt remorse and guilt over leaving Nicky and being gone for so long and him thinking she was dead. Nick doesn't want to believe Juliette is in mortal danger because he loves her, his heart getting in the way of his head.
Oh, I don't doubt Aunt Marie's sincerity. Her logic and vagueness are another matter altogether, however. No one could expect Nick to give up his girlfriend/potential wife and a potential future legacy that might include children over such a warning. He'd be crazy if he did.
Now I'm sure there are a lot of people out there who recall Aunt Marie's warning and are doing the I told you so, saying she prophesized Juliette's death. I can't call it a prophecy because it's not. I can also completely understand why Nick disregarded it.
(06-09-2015, 05:09 PM)Wessenrein Wrote: [ -> ]If you mean the spell Adalind used to turn into Julette? No, I don't think so, I believe even Adalind was shocked that Julette had turned into a Hexxenbeist. I believe that spell was simply to get Nick out of the way by taking his powers, also a bit of retaliation by Adalind since Nick had taken her powers. Also, I do recall Adalind muttering something like; "Since you took something from me, I'm going to take something from you." to that effect and I think it definitely meant Nick's Grimm but it also could have meant Julette, not by killing her but once they realized it was Adalind Nick slept with, Juliette would likely leave Nick even though it wasn't truly his fault.
No, the spell I was talking about was the one Rosalie helped Adalind concoct to remove the hexenbiest from Juliette. Adalind wanted Juliette dead. Do you think she may have poisoned the potion, hoping that Juliette would take it?
In all honesty, when Nick and the scoobies were trying to get her to take this potion, I thought that was among the dumbest things I've seen on television. I completely sided with Juliette on that one.