(10-08-2016, 12:34 AM)izzy Wrote: Hmmm...granted Renard is a fictional character but the portrayed demeanor reminds me of couple of people I have known. I have maintained that just the name of the character is suppose to convey the essence of his character, Renard being French for Fox. And as I have mentioned I always felt he was far more powerful than he ever was willing to let anyone see. Note he fought Kenneth without woging, I thought that was strategic on his part. And he always seemed content to take a few blows from Nick before responding.
I am not sure it is exactly fear, so much as analytical mind desperately trying to gauge just how powerful Bonaparte was and figure out the angle of attack. He may have feared Bonaparte but I doubt it was so much fear of the man as more fear of what he did not know about the man.
When I boxed, (at first) you entered the ring without knowing much if anything about your opponent. So the first round or two, you felt him out. Fed him attacks to see how he defended, how he attacked, how much was feigning to draw a calculated response from you or how much was instinctual or reflective, then you created your strategy and initiated your attack. I used the same methodology in business in boardrooms and meetings throughout the country. Renard reminds me of some very adroit political players I met in those boardrooms and they never show their hand unless it is a feint designed to elicit a response. Those types fear the unknown more than anything, always confident they can outwit their opponents if their intel is good enough.
For all we know, Renard may never have seen what a zauberbiest can actually do. He may be in large part ignorant of his own powers. Part of military training is learning what the human machine is actually capable of. Young men go in after 18 or so year of knowing their bodies, but it is n illusion, they don't really know their bodies.. They come out of basic with a whole knew mindset of what they are actually capable of and the potential they actually have. Often it is only after see someone else do something that opens up the possibility to you. I could find it very believable that Renard does not even know hos own potential and much of power may lay in was unused because he has not even conceived he himself was capable of things. But ow that he has seen Bonaparte that may all change,
Then again, maybe he was afraid of Bonaparte. Perhaps, but I suspect it was more uncertainty than anything. I guess the writers will tell us in time.
Your boxing analogy is an interesting one, izzy. I don't know anything about boxing. I have seen a couple of the Rocky movies, if that means anything. In the second movie, I believe, Rocky goes up against a fighter, played by Mr. T, who has some kind of tremendous boxing advantage. Just for this debate, I'll say a killer right hook (and I had to go look up that boxing move, btw).
Now Rocky didn't have to do a lot of what you were talking about because he already knew his opponent's strengths. There did not to appear to be anything that could be exploited. If I remember the movie correctly, though, after much research, Rocky and his trainer found something that could be useful in Mr. T's footwork (had to go look that up too). The strategy during the fight is to mess around with Mr. T and piss him off so he isn't thinking clearly, then take advantage of his weak footwork with appropriately laid blows.
In order to do this, Rocky has to train even harder, and run up a million steps now instead of just his usual few hundred. He will now have to take a major beating that might kill him, just so he can get Mr. T right where he wants him. He hones in on the crummy footwork and naturally wins the fight, yada, yada, yada.
What I liked about the Rocky movies I saw was that we got to know Rocky as a person. He was a loser and a henchman in the first movie, but he was a pretty likeable guy. He straightened up his act in the second movie, and we got to know him better. What I didn't like about the movie was that we really never got to know Mr. T. Because of that, Mr. T is really more of the villain that Rocky has to defeat rather than an opponent in the ring. Just my opinion.
While a portion of the movie deals with the actual physical fight, the majority of the movie deals with the actual psychological aspects of the fight. Just knowing his opponent has a killer right hook is a huge psychological advantage for Mr. T. It's a huge disadvantage for Rocky. Rocky is afraid of that because it's not just a question of winning based on strategy. It's life or death. Rocky has to conquer that fear before ever going into the ring. I don't believe that means having no fear. I think it means putting it aside and letting his other attributes, strength, agility, etc. take over. It also helps to have a trainer watch for the crummy footwork and yell at Rocky to take the effective punch now and then as well. I guess you could say teamwork saved the day there.
I stopped watching the Rocky movies after that, so I have no idea if he ever faced an opponent who had it all, killer uppercut, perfect footwork, total strategist, etc. I assume there probably is no such thing as we're supposed to believe everyone has some kind of weakness to be exploited.
I agree with you that there's uncertainty here. Renard's uncertainty may lie with the fact that he cannot adequately assess Bonaparte. However, I think his fear of Bonaparte prevents him from even trying. Certainly part of that is the unknown, but I think part of that fear is based on what Renard knows about Bonaparte.
That is shown in two scenes. The first, when Bonaparte turned Adalind to stone and slipped that ring on her finger. Renard was conspicuously absent and therefore, had no idea of his opponent's strategy. Now this wasn't in some courtyard somewhere, it took place in Renard's own house. He should have been present, but he wasn't. Why? I think it was fear of what he knew that kept him out of that room.
The second is when Bonaparte was fighting (and defeating) Nick. Renard did not assist, and seemed paralyzed from doing so, even though he had a killer weapon in hand. He was uncertain as to which side to take and his fear prevented him from making any decision at all. Was it fear of the unknown that kept Renard from reacting? I don't think so. I think it was fear of what he knew. Like I said before, what would have happened had Bonaparte killed Nick and was the one who survived? I don't think he would have been happy with Renard and would have punished him, severely. Luckily for Renard, it was Diana who stepped in to help Renard do what he needed to do and that was kill Bonaparte. So Nick is alive. Renard knows Nick. Will he be able to make some kind of truce with Nick?
Diana's actions here are really worthy of debate. Did she control the situation and force Renard to kill Bonaparte? Did she just give him a little mental push and the rest was his idea? Was she saving Nick? Was she avenging her mother's injuries? Was it teamwork between the two that saved Nick's life?
One final thought. I have no doubt the military shapes a person's mindset. I saw it with my brother. My father was the one who talked my brother into joining the service because he recognized what the military can do.
However, Renard was brought up by a woman. I have no doubt Elizabeth had strength in her own way, but she also is known to flee. She fled the royals to come to the states and she fled after the infamous Juliette becomes the bitch on wheels Eve mess. We know she fled out of fear after getting pregnant with Renard, but why? And why did she flee after the infamous spell mess? What did she have to be afraid of there? We know hexenbiests can turn a situation around to their advantage, yet she chose not to.
What are your thoughts regarding the fact that Renard was brought up by his mother and there was no leading male influence in his life?
Just my thoughts. Have a good one, my friend.
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