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+--- Thread: Hexenbiestdom (/Thread-Hexenbiestdom)
RE: Hexenbiestdom - syscrash - 08-04-2018
Quote: her superlative higher educated attitude just dismissed him as a lower educated insignificant other.This alone shows you have no concept of what writer intent is. writer intent is a premises based on action or narrative that makes express a sub concept. There is nothing in the show that denigrates any of the main characters. The most that is said that they underestimated someone. They have never attacked a characters competence.
What you are stating is not writer intent, It is viewer hyperbole.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - Hell Rell - 08-04-2018
(08-04-2018, 04:33 PM)Henry of green Wrote: Also your previous example of comparing what Jamie did to Cersei to what Adalind did to Nick is a pretty weak one considering no one was forcing Jamie to assault Cersei. Adalind on the other hand was being blackmailed by Viktor, yes Viktor knew exactly what Adalind had to do to get Nick's powers back as one of his first comments he made to her in season 4 was asking what it was like to shag a grimm and she responded I did what I had to to see my daughter I didn’t enjoy it. To put them on the same level of being as equally morally wrong is just plain wrong in my opinion.
I wasn't comparing them morally. Notice that I said we know Adalind didn't do it for a bad reason. There were extenuating circumstances but I still see it as a rape even though we disagree.
I think this is where double standards may play a role because I wonder what the reaction would be if Nick was given the deal to have have sex with Rosalee as the price of getting Kelly back.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - irukandji - 08-04-2018
(08-04-2018, 03:28 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:(08-04-2018, 02:53 PM)irukandji Wrote: But doesn't that make Nick even more of a drooling moron than ever then? At this point in the series, there's no indication Nick and Juliette's love life needs a jump start and so, Juliette must suddenly act wild and crazy for a quickie.
Juliette mustn't but her wanting to do so wouldn't be discouraged by Nick.
This wasn't a case of Nick and Juliette sitting on the couch with nothing to do and Juliette decides to do the wild thing with Nick. Nick wouldn't discourage that and he shouldn't.
But that wasn't the case. Monroe's wedding was an important event, one Nick could not miss. "Juliette" suddenly appearing and encouraging afternoon delight when she made an appointment to have her hair done should have alerted Nick that something was not right. In other words, she's not acting like herself.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - FaceInTheCrowd - 08-04-2018
The grimm business aside, Nick is still one of those typical TV males. They don't know the proper way to load a dishwasher, when they run laundry someone's whites always come out pink and they don't know what the right answer is to "does this make me look fat?" They're oversexed, insensitive, bumbling man-children who escape being divorced, dumped or turned into social outcasts every episode by the skin of their teeth, thanks to the women in their lives who take mercy on them and shrug off their endless flaws. Think Tim Taylor or Homer Simpson with monsters.
Because once you strip away the supernatural and aciton-adventure stuff, it's still TV and the people who write the scripts are the same ones who write Tide commercials and sitcoms.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - Henry of green - 08-05-2018
(08-04-2018, 06:50 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:(08-04-2018, 04:33 PM)Henry of green Wrote: Also your previous example of comparing what Jamie did to Cersei to what Adalind did to Nick is a pretty weak one considering no one was forcing Jamie to assault Cersei. Adalind on the other hand was being blackmailed by Viktor, yes Viktor knew exactly what Adalind had to do to get Nick's powers back as one of his first comments he made to her in season 4 was asking what it was like to shag a grimm and she responded I did what I had to to see my daughter I didn’t enjoy it. To put them on the same level of being as equally morally wrong is just plain wrong in my opinion.
I wasn't comparing them morally. Notice that I said we know Adalind didn't do it for a bad reason. There were extenuating circumstances but I still see it as a rape even though we disagree.
I think this is where double standards may play a role because I wonder what the reaction would be if Nick was given the deal to have have sex with Rosalee as the price of getting Kelly back.
HR, It depends did Rosalee also Kidnap Kelly from Nick causing the incident in the first place and did Rosalee give consent without being drugged or forced agianist her will. Also was Nick being blackmailed to assault Rosalee in order to see his kidnapped child agian, if so I would feel exactly the same way no double standards from me.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - dicappatore - 08-05-2018
(08-04-2018, 02:01 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote:(08-04-2018, 01:36 PM)dicappatore Wrote: I guess your logic keeping secrets longer is better for the relationship.
The reverse, actually.
The night Juliette came upon him in the trailer reading one of the books with a flashlight, Nick should have said something like, "Aunt Marie told me this incredible story, but some things that have been happening lately seem to fit it," then brought her 100% up to speed on what he knew at that point. The two of them could have run a long extension cord out from the house and spent that entire night going through those centuries old books and realized that something really f***ed up was going on. Juliette could have learned with him and made her own fully informed decisions about their life together. Instead, Nick did the typical super hero thing and tried to "protect" people around him by having a "secret identity."
I did agree, he should have told her early on against Monroe's advice. I am sure during S1E21 & 22 the trailer was parked in a storage yard. No extension cord was possible to his house or available to the trailer from any source in the yard, But again, you keep going back to what he should have done. Again, better late than never. You keep repeating better early than never. That makes no sense.
(08-04-2018, 09:56 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: The grimm business aside, Nick is still one of those typical TV males. They don't know the proper way to load a dishwasher, when they run laundry someone's whites always come out pink and they don't know what the right answer is to "does this make me look fat?" They're oversexed, insensitive, bumbling man-children who escape being divorced, dumped or turned into social outcasts every episode by the skin of their teeth, thanks to the women in their lives who take mercy on them and shrug off their endless flaws. Think Tim Taylor or Homer Simpson with monsters.
Because once you strip away the supernatural and aciton-adventure stuff, it's still TV and the people who write the scripts are the same ones who write Tide commercials and sitcoms.
Thats why, you analyze the characters presented on the screen, not what you wished for. The latter has an infinite amount of possibilities. That to me is ridiculous to be able to discuss.
(08-04-2018, 06:24 PM)syscrash Wrote:Quote: her superlative higher educated attitude just dismissed him as a lower educated insignificant other.This alone shows you have no concept of what writer intent is. writer intent is a premises based on action or narrative that makes express a sub concept. There is nothing in the show that denigrates any of the main characters. The most that is said that they underestimated someone. They have never attacked a characters competence.
What you are stating is not writer intent, It is viewer hyperbole.
Because i don't give two shitz on "writers intent". I do give a shitz on what the writers wrote. The writers wrote Monroe to end up as the most popular character. The writers wrote Juliette as a slightly bitchy. My opinion and the similar opinions of must viewers. You might not like it. Welcome to reality.
(08-04-2018, 02:48 PM)brandon Wrote: I do not think it was a superhero action.
I think that policeman- judge, agent of CIA- ever tells everything about his work to his couple.
The topic "Wesen" it was not so easy.
Also Monroe warns him that not everyone accepts him so - remember the guy pursued by those guys " cats".
brandon, what you just said I must have repeated it many times. Detectives can not bring home to their families everything they are exposed to on the job. Some people are just too dense and just keep repeating stuff they have no clue about. It is one thing to debate fantasies, it is another to debate reality and some just don't get "La Realta Della Vita"! I am glad you are intuitive to do so.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - irukandji - 08-05-2018
(08-04-2018, 09:56 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote: The grimm business aside, Nick is still one of those typical TV males. They don't know the proper way to load a dishwasher, when they run laundry someone's whites always come out pink and they don't know what the right answer is to "does this make me look fat?" They're oversexed, insensitive, bumbling man-children who escape being divorced, dumped or turned into social outcasts every episode by the skin of their teeth, thanks to the women in their lives who take mercy on them and shrug off their endless flaws. Think Tim Taylor or Homer Simpson with monsters.
I recall a comment from a poster not so long ago:
"Nick has a history of almost 4 seasons bending over backward for this bitch".
To be sure, the poster who made this comment is now contradicting himself. However, this is not the only comment from the forum that points fingers at Juliette as the issue in the Nick/Juliette relationship. I've never watched the Simpsons, but I have watched Tool Time. Jill could have left Tim and the audience probably would have applauded her for doing so.
It would not have been the same if Juliette had flat out left Nick early in the series. The outcry that would have resulted would have had many criticizing Juliette as the cold hearted snipe and Nick as the compassionate and understanding man who only wanted to put her on a pedestal.
Look at the scenes where Juliette was a hexenbiest and left Nick with no where to go but her car, or those where she kept ignoring Nick's phone calls.
If Nick is the stereotypical male, why the severe criticism of Juliette then?
RE: Hexenbiestdom - Hell Rell - 08-05-2018
(08-05-2018, 01:52 AM)Henry of green Wrote:(08-04-2018, 06:50 PM)Hell Rell Wrote:(08-04-2018, 04:33 PM)Henry of green Wrote: Also your previous example of comparing what Jamie did to Cersei to what Adalind did to Nick is a pretty weak one considering no one was forcing Jamie to assault Cersei. Adalind on the other hand was being blackmailed by Viktor, yes Viktor knew exactly what Adalind had to do to get Nick's powers back as one of his first comments he made to her in season 4 was asking what it was like to shag a grimm and she responded I did what I had to to see my daughter I didn’t enjoy it. To put them on the same level of being as equally morally wrong is just plain wrong in my opinion.
I wasn't comparing them morally. Notice that I said we know Adalind didn't do it for a bad reason. There were extenuating circumstances but I still see it as a rape even though we disagree.
I think this is where double standards may play a role because I wonder what the reaction would be if Nick was given the deal to have have sex with Rosalee as the price of getting Kelly back.
HR, It depends did Rosalee also Kidnap Kelly from Nick causing the incident in the first place and did Rosalee give consent without being drugged or forced agianist her will. Also was Nick being blackmailed to assault Rosalee in order to see his kidnapped child agian, if so I would feel exactly the same way no double standards from me.
Even though we're diametrically opposed, I have taken your thoughts into consideration. We're not going to agree but I can't say you're not being objective here.
To be clear, I brought up Jamie and Cersei to quash the notion that there's no rape if the writers say there's isn't one. There was one depicted on screen regardless of their intentions.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - FaceInTheCrowd - 08-05-2018
(08-05-2018, 06:46 AM)irukandji Wrote: If Nick is the stereotypical male, why the severe criticism of Juliette then?
I suspect that there are some people who identify with the stereotypical male.
RE: Hexenbiestdom - brandon - 08-05-2018
What stereotype?
He wants to get married and she rejects him for suspecting something secret.
It was good reason but it was a silly.
Someone thinks that your partner should tell you 100%? . Is good? I do not think so.
Nick told him about the kiss of Ariel. I do not know. I do not think it would have been. Nor of the matter " Marie/ Farley.
That was a secret of Marie K.