(02-10-2017, 05:49 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: Now again IMO only real life can make a hero, in real life there are very very few real anti heros. A police officer or fireman who saves someone hero, a soldier on a battlefield is a hero just by being there. Being a hero doesn't make the man a good or bad man or woman just their actions at the time makes them a hero.

(02-10-2017, 05:38 AM)speakeasy Wrote: Grimm is a show that metaphorically portrays the problems that occur in a real society when folks are living in a period of historical transition, such as is the case in America. We have concentrated on constitutionally guaranteeing the civil rights of all minorities in recent years. Most Americans are members of some or other minority group today. I'm heartened to see this. But it's created a terrible divide in the country (HW vs BC in Grimm) which is the painful result of the rebirth of the concept of equality, imo. This is sad, but I believe art imitates life on Grimm.

If I lost most posters so far, this opinion holds no water.

(02-10-2017, 05:38 AM)speakeasy Wrote: But I'll finish anyway. Languages are living things; a descriptive meaning of a particular word evolves, or at least changes as times passes, to suit the times. If that premise is accepted as valid, then what describes a hero must change. In my view, Nick is indeed a contemporary hero. That he's heroic is one of the few consistencies the show has kept to over the years.

(02-10-2017, 07:14 AM)izzy Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 05:49 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: Now again IMO only real life can make a hero, in real life there are very very few real anti heros. A police officer or fireman who saves someone hero, a soldier on a battlefield is a hero just by being there. Being a hero doesn't make the man a good or bad man or woman just their actions at the time makes them a hero.

At one point I read:

It is fortune or chance chiefly that makes heroes.

As an adolescent I always puzzled over that statement. Weren't heroes made or born? But as I aged (and aged I have) I see the truth in those words.

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(02-10-2017, 05:38 AM)speakeasy Wrote: Grimm is a show that metaphorically portrays the problems that occur in a real society when folks are living in a period of historical transition, such as is the case in America. We have concentrated on constitutionally guaranteeing the civil rights of all minorities in recent years. Most Americans are members of some or other minority group today. I'm heartened to see this. But it's created a terrible divide in the country (HW vs BC in Grimm) which is the painful result of the rebirth of the concept of equality, imo. This is sad, but I believe art imitates life on Grimm.

If I lost most posters so far, this opinion holds no water.

Your observation is spot on, I am not sure I agree with the overall tenor of the sentiment, but, the observation reflects reality.

(02-10-2017, 05:38 AM)speakeasy Wrote: But I'll finish anyway. Languages are living things; a descriptive meaning of a particular word evolves, or at least changes as times passes, to suit the times. If that premise is accepted as valid, then what describes a hero must change. In my view, Nick is indeed a contemporary hero. That he's heroic is one of the few consistencies the show has kept to over the years.

I must say I find your comments refreshing. As in elevating the conversation.

I'll just say, continuing on a general theme of mine, that I believe that the idea that Nick is a hero in today's culture is rather a barometer by which we can measure the degradation of this nation's once great endemic culture.

Thanks for your commentary.

(02-10-2017, 07:14 AM)izzy Wrote: I'll just say, continuing on a general theme of mine, that I believe that the idea that Nick is a hero in today's culture is rather a barometer by which we can measure the degradation of this nation's once great endemic culture.

Thanks for your commentary.

(02-10-2017, 07:50 PM)speakeasy Wrote: You may be correct in your assessment that Nick's being heroic to some fans is a result of the lowering of the ethical bar by which we measure it. He's not Captain America, but he is much more genuine in his humanity, imo.

(02-10-2017, 07:50 PM)speakeasy Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 07:14 AM)izzy Wrote: I'll just say, continuing on a general theme of mine, that I believe that the idea that Nick is a hero in today's culture is rather a barometer by which we can measure the degradation of this nation's once great endemic culture.

Thanks for your commentary.

The good news is minority groups such as black Americans, members of the LGBT community, all women, and the physically and mentally challenged have had their rights recognized by acts of law in most developed countries, and especially in the USA. The bad news is it has caused great upheaval in our society as we try to adjust to this new age.

Our nation's culture is richer and greater than ever, imo. But I'm not saying we have assimilated these enormous changes into the mix by any measure. It still feels like the rug's been pulled out from under us. These are scary times because we can no longer fall back on the accepted standards and mores we structured our lives around some decades back. It must be harder for those of religious faith. My feeling is it will take at least three generations to adjust to this new norm. But I have high hopes that it will improve the general lot of most of humankind.

You may be correct in your assessment that Nick's being heroic to some fans is a result of the lowering of the ethical bar by which we measure it. He's not Captain America, but he is much more genuine in his humanity, imo. Flawed but not corrupt. Uncertain but resolute. Self-contained but affectionate. Fierce but compassionate. He's a Grimm with a conscience; he's an aberration, a born executioner who acknowledges the Wesen right to life and the Wesen way of life. He's a low-keyed phenomenon, in my view.

He has killed, and he's killed for revenge. But he's used his power to destroy only wesen who do harm and has rescued countless innocent victims, both Wesen and Kehrisiete. He's a warrior on the front lines of a daily battle in the world of Grimm. He's not the hero of the halcyon days of our youth, but a more recognizable one of the here and now.

But I digress, haha. This thread is about A's apology to E. It wasn't the Gettysburg Address, but it was reflective of Adalind's emerging desire to admit to her transgressions as she leaves behind her Hexenbiest ways. I guess.

(02-10-2017, 08:31 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 07:50 PM)speakeasy Wrote: You may be correct in your assessment that Nick's being heroic to some fans is a result of the lowering of the ethical bar by which we measure it. He's not Captain America, but he is much more genuine in his humanity, imo.

You do know that in his last movie, Captain America opted to become a lawbreaker and is now a fugitive, right...?

(02-11-2017, 04:29 AM)speakeasy Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 08:31 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 07:50 PM)speakeasy Wrote: You may be correct in your assessment that Nick's being heroic to some fans is a result of the lowering of the ethical bar by which we measure it. He's not Captain America, but he is much more genuine in his humanity, imo.

You do know that in his last movie, Captain America opted to become a lawbreaker and is now a fugitive, right...?

I love, love, luuurve, Captain America. He's my favorite of the Marvel Avengers. My grandsons both think he's too much of a goody-goody, times they are a-changin'. Like so many of us, I've got a foot in the old world and one in the new.

Haven't seen his last movie, and it stings to know he's had to compromise his generation's values to follow his own conscience (hope that's what made him break the law and fall off the grid), but I'll just have to carry on.

(02-11-2017, 05:00 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote:

(02-11-2017, 04:29 AM)speakeasy Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 08:31 PM)FaceInTheCrowd Wrote:

(02-10-2017, 07:50 PM)speakeasy Wrote: You may be correct in your assessment that Nick's being heroic to some fans is a result of the lowering of the ethical bar by which we measure it. He's not Captain America, but he is much more genuine in his humanity, imo.

You do know that in his last movie, Captain America opted to become a lawbreaker and is now a fugitive, right...?

I love, love, luuurve, Captain America. He's my favorite of the Marvel Avengers. My grandsons both think he's too much of a goody-goody, times they are a-changin'. Like so many of us, I've got a foot in the old world and one in the new.

Haven't seen his last movie, and it stings to know he's had to compromise his generation's values to follow his own conscience (hope that's what made him break the law and fall off the grid), but I'll just have to carry on.

Your are correct on why he is fugitive. VERY GOOD GUESS

Quote:The modern hero is what used to be called an anti-hero. To find virtuous heroes like the ones you need to see you'll have to switch to the Hallmark Channel.