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+--- Thread: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt (/Thread-Nicholas-Nick-Burkhardt)
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - syscrash - 12-28-2016
So irukandji do you think the frog girl should have been charged with murder?
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - brandon - 12-28-2016
Would be manslaughter not premeditated.And only happened when some man was attracted to her.I think it just happened with some men,That's why lived like this.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - irukandji - 12-28-2016
(12-28-2016, 12:39 PM)syscrash Wrote: So irukandji do you think the frog girl should have been charged with murder?
There were no witnesses to the first death, from what I recall. Nick would have to charge her with murder I would think.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - jsgrimm45 - 12-28-2016
(12-28-2016, 11:51 AM)irukandji Wrote:Just as ta thought should we look for any wesen Nick killed or arrested that wasn't breaking a law at the time? All laws are open to the state or feds on what is going to be charged even a speeding ticket.(12-28-2016, 11:41 AM)syscrash Wrote: Take the father in star crossed. He was law abiding. He only struck Nick because Nick was a Grimm. Are you saying Nick was wrong for bending the law and not charging him for striking an officer.
That's exactly what I'm saying. These people came to the US, they're citizens. It's against the law to strike an officer of the law. They should be charged. You're excusing the guy because he let his wesen nature get the better of him. Not every wesen goes right out and hits a law officer. This guy shouldn't be entitled to special privileges.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - brandon - 12-28-2016
Nick had a chance to let Adalind kill and he did not.Some say that if he had done it, it would be for "GRIMM".That would have been carried away by revenge and not by justice.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - irukandji - 12-28-2016
(12-28-2016, 07:52 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: Would you say a soldier lives in two world which has two different set of rules? When a soldier is at home one set of rules, when on the battlefield those no longer apply. Should we apply the same to Nick?
I've no experience with the military, js, so I am taking a huge guess based on my father, who served in Korea. He didn't live in two different worlds simultaneously, like Nick. He had his days in the war and his days as a civilian.
To my surprise, I found out not so long ago that my father suffered from PTSD as the result of his days in the Korean War. He never sought treatment for it, but instead got a job on the police force, married, and eventually got over it. He never even went to the VA until he was in his late 70s and that was to get hearing aids and treatment for his back. So, while he kept his two worlds separate, apparently the effects of his military service crept into his civilian life.
You and I have talked about the frog girl episode several times and was thinking about the episode again today, actually before syscrash asked me about it. I know you believe Nick did the right thing in letting her go. I do not.
There are a few things about the episode that continue to bug me. First and foremost, this is another of Grimm's dumbest wesen attributes, next to the invisible woge. There is no natural reason for these women to have poisonous skin, other than for Nick to feel sorry for them and so he lets the pretty one go. Then there's the question of who mated with a poison dart frog way back when and why?
Second, I don't get why these women haven't devised some sort of anti-venom to protect those around them. Because they have not, and the pretty one knows she's poisonous and can inflict death with merely a touch, it's her fault. There's no other way around it.
Third, I have to wonder about Nick himself on this one. If the frog girl had weighed 300 pounds, had stringy greasy hair and was six foot one, would he have arrested her? I'd lay odds the answer would be in the affirmative and that just tells me right there Nick is not as objective as he thinks he is.
Just some thoughts on the frog girl.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - syscrash - 12-28-2016
Quote:There are a few things about the episode that continue to bug me. First and foremost, this is another of Grimm's dumbest wesen attributes, next to the invisible woge. There is no natural reason for these women to have poisonous skin, other than for Nick to feel sorry for them and so he lets the pretty one go. Then there's the question of who mated with a poison dart frog way back when and why?One good reason for the frog girl to be poisonous. it would prevent the frog from mating with anything other then another frog.
Quote:the pretty one knows she's poisonous and can inflict death with merely a touch, it's her fault. There's no other way around it.So irukandji in your world should having a communicable disease be a death sentence? Would you have advocated to execute the ebola victims. How about the ones that infected others. Was that their fault.
The use of the frog girl was to make and ethical argument. The reason they had her using preventive measures. They wanted to establish her as not being responsible. Making it a situation out of her control. That they made her good looking and the historical solution was disfigurement. Was a comment on the stereotypical male view on beauty. The idea that men would not find the unattractive appealing. Even your comment " If the frog girl had weighed 300 pounds, had stringy greasy hair and was six foot one, would he have arrested her" shows the same bias toward beauty.
At least in the show they over came the beauty bias. By giving her a mate even though the cure had altered her looks.
irukandji I don't know about you but I find your description to be cruel. And to say that is the characters view ignores Nick was attracted to the daemonfeuer and the muse. Showing he is not hung up on looks. Even Juliette as a hexenbiest. Many assumed it was her look that turned him off. But Juliette looks like Adalind when woged and he doesn't have a problem with Adalind.
The show has used this definition of beauty several times to show bias. Rosalee is one example. As a fushbau many think she is cute. Yet if someone actually meet a fushbau most would consider her a freak and ugly. A point made by using a fushbau in the circus.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - irukandji - 12-29-2016
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: One good reason for the frog girl to be poisonous. it would prevent the frog from mating with anything other then another frog.
And the natural purpose of that would be to what? Eventually wipe out the frog people? That could be. But for me, I don't see it other than a dumb reason for Nick to get involved so we can once again see how compassionate he is, how wonderful he is, how sympathetic he is, yada, yada, yada
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: So irukandji in your world should having a communicable disease be a death sentence? Would you have advocated to execute the ebola victims. How about the ones that infected others. Was that their fault.
Syscrash, you're the one who's talking about death for ebola victims. I'm talking about a frog girl in Grimm. I would suggest you use similar comparisons and stick to the debate.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: The use of the frog girl was to make and ethical argument. The reason they had her using preventive measures. They wanted to establish her as not being responsible. Making it a situation out of her control.
It's not an ethical argument. It's an episode to show just how compassionate Nick is. That's all it boils down to. You say her people aren't responsible. So the answer is, go among the general population and just hope they don't accidentally bump into someone? Since when is that kind of thinking ethical?
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: That they made her good looking and the historical solution was disfigurement. Was a comment on the stereotypical male view on beauty. The idea that men would not find the unattractive appealing. Even your comment " If the frog girl had weighed 300 pounds, had stringy greasy hair and was six foot one, would he have arrested her" shows the same bias toward beauty.
[quote='syscrash' pid='39135' dateline='1482987471']
At least in the show they over came the beauty bias. By giving her a mate even though the cure had altered her looks.
Yes, they replaced her bias all right. As with Grimm something is usually exchanged for something that comes with a price. She now has the bias of a tattooed face. By the way, syscrash, how do you know that's her mate? All we see is her out eating with a guy.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: irukandji I don't know about you but I find your description to be cruel.
The frog girl is cruel, syscrash.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: And to say that is the characters view ignores Nick was attracted to the daemonfeuer and the muse. Showing he is not hung up on looks. Even Juliette as a hexenbiest. Many assumed it was her look that turned him off. But Juliette looks like Adalind when woged and he doesn't have a problem with Adalind.
Lest we forget how Nick obsessively tried to "fix" Juliette. As for Adalind, Nick doesn't get the humanitarian award for his treatment of her in my opinion. She's told him she loves him several times. She might as well told him she was going out to change the tire on his car for all of the reaction she got.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: The show has used this definition of beauty several times to show bias. Rosalee is one example. As a fushbau many think she is cute. Yet if someone actually meet a fushbau most would consider her a freak and ugly. A point made by using a fushbau in the circus.
If you're saying the show is showing Nick's bias, as in he'll go out of his way to rescue the pretty girls, then yes, I agree.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - jsgrimm45 - 12-29-2016
(12-29-2016, 06:13 AM)irukandji Wrote:I really hate to say this but Hollywood doesn't hire a lot of not pretty women. So ever TV series likely has pretty women.(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: One good reason for the frog girl to be poisonous. it would prevent the frog from mating with anything other then another frog.
And the natural purpose of that would be to what? Eventually wipe out the frog people? That could be. But for me, I don't see it other than a dumb reason for Nick to get involved so we can once again see how compassionate he is, how wonderful he is, how sympathetic he is, yada, yada, yada
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: So irukandji in your world should having a communicable disease be a death sentence? Would you have advocated to execute the ebola victims. How about the ones that infected others. Was that their fault.
Syscrash, you're the one who's talking about death for ebola victims. I'm talking about a frog girl in Grimm. I would suggest you use similar comparisons and stick to the debate.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: The use of the frog girl was to make and ethical argument. The reason they had her using preventive measures. They wanted to establish her as not being responsible. Making it a situation out of her control.
It's not an ethical argument. It's an episode to show just how compassionate Nick is. That's all it boils down to. You say her people aren't responsible. So the answer is, go among the general population and just hope they don't accidentally bump into someone? Since when is that kind of thinking ethical?
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: That they made her good looking and the historical solution was disfigurement. Was a comment on the stereotypical male view on beauty. The idea that men would not find the unattractive appealing. Even your comment " If the frog girl had weighed 300 pounds, had stringy greasy hair and was six foot one, would he have arrested her" shows the same bias toward beauty.
[quote='syscrash' pid='39135' dateline='1482987471']
At least in the show they over came the beauty bias. By giving her a mate even though the cure had altered her looks.
Yes, they replaced her bias all right. As with Grimm something is usually exchanged for something that comes with a price. She now has the bias of a tattooed face. By the way, syscrash, how do you know that's her mate? All we see is her out eating with a guy.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: irukandji I don't know about you but I find your description to be cruel.
The frog girl is cruel, syscrash.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: And to say that is the characters view ignores Nick was attracted to the daemonfeuer and the muse. Showing he is not hung up on looks. Even Juliette as a hexenbiest. Many assumed it was her look that turned him off. But Juliette looks like Adalind when woged and he doesn't have a problem with Adalind.
Lest we forget how Nick obsessively tried to "fix" Juliette. As for Adalind, Nick doesn't get the humanitarian award for his treatment of her in my opinion. She's told him she loves him several times. She might as well told him she was going out to change the tire on his car for all of the reaction she got.
(12-28-2016, 09:57 PM)syscrash Wrote: The show has used this definition of beauty several times to show bias. Rosalee is one example. As a fushbau many think she is cute. Yet if someone actually meet a fushbau most would consider her a freak and ugly. A point made by using a fushbau in the circus.
If you're saying the show is showing Nick's bias, as in he'll go out of his way to rescue the pretty girls, then yes, I agree.
RE: Nicholas "Nick" Burkhardt - New Guy - 12-29-2016
(12-29-2016, 07:16 AM)jsgrimm45 Wrote: If you're saying the show is showing Nick's bias, as in he'll go out of his way to rescue the pretty girls, then yes, I agree.I really hate to say this but Hollywood doesn't hire a lot of not pretty women. So ever TV series likely has pretty women.
[/quote]
Hi JS,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puJ99egc884
Couldn't help myself.
N G